Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Denpasan

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. Closing this way based in the fact that Martijn Hoekstra did not find sufficient consensus to make a call on the 11th and there have been no comments since then. Ron Ritzman (talk) 00:47, 27 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Denpasan

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

This is a dictionary definition and is non notable, though interesting. It has no place in an encyclopaedia Fiddle Faddle (talk) 10:47, 29 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I want to respond to the deletion nomination of Denpasan article I just started, which links from the article Arakawa Under the Bridge. First I would like more time to complete it before it gets deleted. It's my first post so bare with me. I had only just posted the stub when it was already nominated. I think it would be useful for those unfamiliar to the subtleties of Japanese culture and I have some firsthand knowledge. Second, you mention that this is a "This is a dictionary definition and is non notable", but I could not find it elsewhere on the web, otherwise I would not have went to the trouble to post is here. I appreciate your vote of confidence, but in writing this stub I was actually writing from my own personal experience from living and working in Japan. However, if you can find it defined adequately somewhere on the web, then there is certainly no need for it to be here on Wiki. You say "it has no place in an encyclopedia" but I have read a few articles on Wiki about Japan and its culture. They were quite helpful to me for surviving in Japan. You seemed sure that it could be found. If so could you please share a link. I am currently in China and may not be able to search it properly here due to internet restrictions in place here. Ckchanin67 (talk) 11:53, 29 February 2012 (UTC)Ckchanin67Ckchanin67 (talk) 11:53, 29 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The process takes several days. During that period if you can enhance the notability then please do so. Doing this is likely to save the article. Fiddle Faddle (talk) 13:05, 29 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Japan-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 14:07, 29 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Language-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 14:07, 29 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: Those wanting to look for sources might try Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL. FWIW I found dozens of (what I gather are) blog references, but not much else. More thorough searching might find something useful. Cnilep (talk) 07:14, 1 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. As far as I can tell, this was a term that was invented in Arakawa Under the Bridge, so it's not even really a dictionary entry. It is not a term or phrase that has received in-depth media coverage or become a social phenomenon, so a brief explanation of its meaning added to the Arakawa Under the Bridge article should be more than sufficient. No way does this justify a self-standing article inflated with unsourced original research as at present. --DAJF (talk) 07:33, 1 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Comment. This is a widespread concept in anime and manga culture, and there is an article on it at ja:電波系 (denpa-kei). Searching for sources about it will be tricky, though - the concept is often referred to simply as 電波 (denpa), but 電波 also has the much more common meaning of "electromagnetic wave". The Japanese Wikipedia article gives some juicy details which make me suspect I will be voting "keep": for example, it says that the term probably came into use after the 1981 Fukagawa-doori murder case, in which the murderer claimed that "electromagnetic waves told me to do it"; it also says that the manga writer Takashi Nemoto popularised the phrase, writing several magazine articles about people who were supposedly "denpa-kei". However, the ja-wiki article is unsourced, so I can't say for sure that we should keep the English one until I do a proper source search. — Mr. Stradivarius ^♫ 00:22, 2 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I found one source, a mention in a book about characterization in light Japanese novels. It's not the most detailed coverage, but it's a start.[1] — Mr. Stradivarius ^♫ 01:05, 2 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

And here is another one, this time a whole book about "denpa-san" people. This one looks like it comes from the gutter press, though, and may be sensationalist. However, it does looks like a good indication that "denpa-san" has entered the Japanese popular consciousness. — Mr. Stradivarius ^♫ 01:20, 2 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

There is little point in simply placing those references here. Place then in the article if you believe that they enhance and verify its notability. Fiddle Faddle (talk) 09:15, 2 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you, Mr. Stradivarius, for placing those references here. They give participants and the closing admin some idea of how notable the topic is (somewhat, at least in some subcultures) and what sorts of reliable sources may be available (at least a few, but not of the highest quality). Cnilep (talk) 00:59, 7 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, that was pretty much my impression that I got from my source search - a whole slew of primary sources, in the form of light novels and manga that have "denpa" characters, but only a few references in reliable secondary sources. I think this is one of those articles that would require some research time in a Japanese library to do properly. ~~Until someone does this, I think perhaps an appropriate fate would be to merge this article to a new "characterization" section in Light novel, keeping only the parts that are verifiable.~~ — Mr. Stradivarius ^♫ 03:36, 7 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Keep There is sufficient information to warrant keeping the article, while we source it further. Articles need time to grow, and people to work on them. DGG ( talk ) 04:33, 8 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. On reflection, I think DGG is right - the current problems with verifiability can be fixed through editing, and the subject seems notable enough. I'll have a little go at fixing it up. — Mr. Stradivarius ^♫ 05:57, 10 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Ok, I have added the light novel characterization source to the article, and translated a couple of sentences from the Japanese Wikipedia that looked like they were probably true (they still need refs, though). I also got rid of the whole of the original content, because it looks like it was a bit of a mischaracterization - denpa-san is more of an awkward or distant personality type, and doesn't have so much to do with a conscious rejection of societal norms. (At least, that's the impression I gathered from the limited sources and from the Japanese Wikipedia article.) — Mr. Stradivarius ^♫ 09:42, 10 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Martijn Hoekstra (talk) 21:24, 11 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Alpha_Quadrant (talk) 05:07, 19 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.