Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Alejandro Alcondez (2nd nomination)

This discussion was subject to a deletion review on 2011 March 5.
For an explanation of the process, see Wikipedia:Deletion review.

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. MBisanz ^talk 03:23, 2 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Alejandro Alcondez

I nominated this actor for deletion a while ago, and my reasons as before are the same today, in that he is a non-notable actor/director/producer, ect. The previous discussion reached "No consensus" but the majority of the 'keep' votes all pointed to his 'lengthy' career as seen on IMDB. However, the majority of these films are all dtv movies with miniscule information, none of which would pass the notability requirements for Wikipedia. As one person argued, "If I make a low-budget film off of a digital camera, which I write, produce, direct, and star in, and release it to a very limited audience, does that make me notable? Just because I did everything on it? Where in WP:BIO does having multiple non-notable roles make you notable?

A lot of the article is unsourced, and a lot of it's fluff, as seen as in this sentence: "As an adolescent his spare time was used for reading and watching movies. He remembers telling his friends “one day you will see me on the big screen” soon after he was know as the dreamer. One afternoon Alcondez went to see a movie starring Mexican actor Mario Almada, it was then that he knew acting was his dream and his passion." I wouldn't be surprised if there was a Conflict of Interest in this article, as there was in a previous version that was speedily deleted. CyberGhostface (talk) 15:49, 22 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. If the unverified facts mentioned by CyberGhost were deleted, I'd say that this is a pretty good article. He's not non-notable, he's created and starred in lots of films and theatre productions. Good quality writing, too. TopGearFreak ^Talk 17:50, 22 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- As I said before, the majority of these films are all DTVs that wouldn't pass notability here if someone were to make an article for them. Three of the sources are links to the subject's youtube page, and one of them is a blog.--CyberGhostface (talk) 18:45, 22 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  - As I suspected, I just ran a number of his films (in addition to his name) through Google and they all had a small number of results.--CyberGhostface (talk) 18:57, 22 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I would like to thank all for your opinions and observations, on the issue of the article in question. First of all and according to you post, that the majority of these films are all "DTV (Distrubuted for TV??) movies with miniscule information", some of them I realize from what I found have been released in DVD format (like many other feature films from the past), and probably produced with that in mind but if you observe the quality of some of the films, they are pre-DVD era which may suggest that they were originally released for theatre in the 1990's and before for the Mexican market, along with other films of the same genre at that time period.

I did not state that all the films of this actor were made for the big screen and in the issue of notability, well there are hundreds of personalities that are famous and yet no one has bothered to post any information on them in the Net.

On the point of the "Low budget film with digital camera..." from what I’ve seen in the internet almost all of the actors on YouTube pages for this actor, are well know to the Latin Community including Alejandro Alcondez, which suggests a Budget of a lot more than the price of a digital camera and home editing equipment.

In reference to the "Fluff", I must apologize for the comment made, I know I read it in an article for a magazine some time ago, and because a can't make (find) a valid reference, thank you for removing that part in accordance to the rules of Wikipedia.

In the conflict of interest issue, I must again accept my inexperience of correct style of writing and I appreciate some pointers on how to avoid them but please and with all due respect this does not mean I have a conflict of interest issue. I will correct as needed.

On the DTV notability issue, this article is about this celebrated actor and not about his individual accomplishments or works. As I stated above some films apparently are (re)distributed in DVD format just as any other film from the past. The YouTube sources seem to have a wealth of information on this actor and his achievements, and the Blog referenced is from a well know artist/singer [1] that verifies the information of the article in question.

In reference to the small number of google results, I honestly ignore the volume necessary for notability to be acceptable in Wikipedia, I just concentrated my efforts on the quality of the information I could find.

I would like to post some references from 3rd parties that include information on this subject matter. In reference to the DTV issue there is a film according to IMDB called "Cielito Lindo" which is soon to be released according to some of these sources:

Sound Post production the company is called Juniper Post [2] In the IMDB

Backlotimaging partipated in the making of a Fanfare logo for Alejandro Alcondez Pictures which indicates the upcoming release of the film: [3] which states the following: "It has been really exciting to work with celebrated Mexican filmmaker Alejandro Alcondez to create a new animated fanfare for his film production company. This new 3D animation will be attached to his upcoming American releases on 35mm."

Here is a partial reference of actors that are in the cast of the film "Cielito Lindo" some are know more than others but the fact is that they participate in the film mentioned:

Nicole Paggi [4] Ilia Volok [5] Nestor Serrano [6] Adam Rodriguez [7] Bernardo Peña [8] David Castro [9] Mariela Santos [10] Alex Bovicelli [11] Antonio Costa [12]

Here's one more reference to the production and description of the film which some of the actors mentioned participate [13] which states a lot of information about the film "Cielito Lindo" in spanish

Some other information I found on the net was from a news type website: [14] in which there is a picture of Alejandro Alcondez with text that states the following (excerpt in english) “the kid on the right is a film and theatre actor Alejandro Alcondez in which some films have been reviewed in this website”

Here is one more that talks about one of his films [15] referencing other works done by this actor: (english translation) Alejandro Alcondez “2004 Los Mas Buscados” with Jorge Reynoso and Fernando Saenz (ref. to some soap opera). Alejandro Alcondez resides in Los Angeles, Ca. since 1980 started his career 23 years ago with the theatrical debut “Damelas sin compromise” which in “Blanquita” Theatre in East Los Angeles in 1981. His debut in Film Theatre with well know veteran actor Mario Almada in 1988 in a film called “Impacto de Muerte.”

I would like to thank all for your patience. Cgomez007 (talk) —Preceding undated comment was added at 03:55, 23 November 2008 (UTC).[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so that consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Ron Ritzman (talk) 00:08, 27 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Actors and actresses-related deletion discussions. -- • Gene93k (talk) 07:49, 27 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Living people-related deletion discussions. -- • Gene93k (talk) 07:50, 27 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Delete for failing WP:ENTERTAINER and WP:CREATIVE. There's something that needs to be clear here. Starring in, writing or directing multiple films cannot be considered as notability. Notability would be defined particularly by the quality of work produced, its critical reception and its viewer reception (revenue et al.). Most (or perhaps neither) of his films have significant viewer following and/or critical reception in English speaking world. As for the following in the Latino community, even in that case Youtube and couple of mentions in the media can't really be termed as sufficient for establishing notability. There has to be more critical coverage and other such response to his works. Considering that he has started working in Hollywood and his recent work is getting some spotlight might make him notable in the future, but not at present. ^LeaveSleaves _talk 18:04, 27 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Delete I can't find coverage in reliable sources to fulfill any of the notability criteria for actors. Raven1977 (talk) 23:18, 30 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.