Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/2019 Latin American protests

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Acknowledging the content and the possibility of merger, anyone requiring the content to do this should place a listing at WP:REFUND. Stifle (talk) 15:48, 27 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

2019 Latin American protests

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Hi.

I am bringing this article into the elimination debate because I understand it to be a case similar to Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Protests of 2019 (2nd nomination).

I feel that this article was built with a mixture of opinions and writings from journalists trying to find a connection with all the protests that took place in Latin America in 2019, but the reality is that it is not a wave of protests, but several protests with different objectives, dimensions and ideological positions. Unlike the Arab Spring and the Revolutions of 1989, there is no real connection between all the protests listed in this article. They are individual and disconnected protests.

For example, in the case of Bolivia, there were protests by right-wing groups against electoral fraud by a left-wing government, there was an action by the military (passively, but there was) and an evangelical-oriented government was established, something that did not happen in other countries.[1] In Venezuela, the protests have been held since 2014, so can not be considered part of a wave, because it is at other times. In Nicaragua, idem; protests have been taking place since 2018 against a leftist government. [2]

On the other hand, in Chile, in Ecuador and in Colombia there were protests by left-wing groups against neoliberalism and the austerities policies of right-wing governments.[3] [4]

Other countries are mentioned, but let's be clear: if the protests did not happen daily, if there was only one incident, this should not be enough to consider them part of a wave, which includes Mexico and Paraguay.

The article aims to build a speech that, supposedly, all the Latin American protests that took place in 2019 are a same phenomenon, which is not true. There is a rigged interpretation, and not neutral, over-dimensioning some phenomena or mixing others, because in any democracy it is normal for different people or groups to protest, or march, whether women, gays or farmers. And what the article intends, by mixed information or confused interpretation, is to put everything in the same category: a protest in Chile, another in Venezuela, with normal protests or strikes, to establish that there was a wave of protests. Readers are being lied to, cheating or confusing them, by telling them that what happened in Chile is the same, what happened in Bolivia or Venezuela, since the protests have nothing to do with each other.

The concept is unavoidably synthesis and original research. As regards the individual protests discussed in this article, every single one of them that is actually notable already has its own page. Fontaine347 (talk) 23:16, 9 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Politics-related deletion discussions. Fontaine347 (talk) 23:16, 9 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Social science-related deletion discussions. Fontaine347 (talk) 23:16, 9 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Latin America-related deletion discussions. Fontaine347 (talk) 23:16, 9 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Keep probably needs work, and there has been a discussion about merging with Latin American Spring, which I wouldn't be opposed to. When this article was started, I made sure to exclude Venezuela for reasons above, and there have been debates on other countries not part of the spring/wave. Honestly, google 'Primavera latinoamericana', (Latin American Spring): it is very much a thing. The region has a very interconnected economic history that has spurred a lot of the tribulations that causes the various protests, some directly and some indirectly. (And I was a massive advocate for deleting the Protests of 2019 article, so don't worry, I understand exactly where you're coming from) Kingsif (talk) 23:28, 9 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Lol I missed the second nom of Protests of 2016, glad it ended that way. These are unrelated events that merely happened on the same continent. Content that makes up the majority of the article is purely original research that summarizes the concept of modern-day protesting and what happened in these, but inappropriately suggests they all have interconnected causes, backgrounds, and methods. Links in List of protests in the 21st century with some prose discussion is welcome, or reasonable expansion in Latin American Spring#2019, but something that happens regularly around the world for a variety of reasons need not be synthesized as one. Reywas92^Talk 04:45, 10 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Your comment both acknowledges the Latin American Spring is real, but also tries to claim that protests in Latin America are unconnected. Do you see the issue? Kingsif (talk) 19:26, 12 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The Latin American Spring article should be limited to listing specific protests that have very clear similarities and connections; it is to an extent but is still problematic. The article at hand has significantly more synthesis and with the table at the bottom lumps together every protest in every country. Just happening in the same year in the same region is not a commonality as this presents. Protests happen regularly all around the world, and even when commentators discuss multiple contemporaneous protests that were caused by entirely different reasons, it is orginal research and unencyclopedic to present them as one. Reywas92^Talk 19:45, 13 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

"Latin American Spring" is also a problematic article. It was even deleted from the Spanish Wikipedia because it was considered an original research and an essay. This article should not be about an incontrovertible phenomenon (wave of protests), but it should be revised to describe a term / political neologism used by journalists.

If we search Google for "2019 Latin American protests", we will obviously find several results because protests took place in Latin America in 2019, but that does not mean that all these protests are connected. Most of the existing sources are opinions and journalists writings trying to find similarities and differences among all the protests. This text of Washington Post shows how protests in Latin America are distinct from each other.

I admit that the protests in Chile, Colombia, Ecuador have similarities, but what happened in these three countries has nothing to do with the protests in Bolivia, Nicaragua, Venezuela and Puerto Rico that are mentioned in 2019 Latin American protests#Affected countries and in this template. --Fontaine347 (talk) 00:31, 13 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Then you can clean it up? You're also saying "it's a thing, but the article is too broad". WP:SOFIXIT Kingsif (talk) 22:56, 13 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete: Far, far, far too broad: treating all protests for a whole year over a whole continent as a unitary thing? Definitely fails WP:SYNTH, and probably needs TNT or a vast reduction in focus and renaming. SOFIXIT? Fix what? Is there any particular reason to draw together economic (or political, or environmental, or ethnic, or conflict-based) protests between more than one South American country as opposed -- say -- to 2019 protests in Ecuador and Tajikistan and Malawi? Ravenswing 16:46, 17 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Sandstein 11:12, 18 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Delete way to broad of a subject and no proof that they are all somehow connected. Plus, TNT clearly applies. An article with a different name that's just about the ones that can be proven to be connected would probably work though. --Adamant1 (talk) 12:43, 18 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. Clearly original research. It's just like it tries to connect different events in order to create a bigger everything. This and Latin American Spring (that is not such, not one of those "springs" promoted by external actors) should be deleted. Chilean protests were due to social discontent to the high unequality of the society and the political and legal system that promotes the status quo, while Bolivian protests were mainly political and electoral. Peruvian protests were also unrelated, and mainly raised because high-profile political corruption. There were contemporary protests, but unrelated each other, and these protests didn't inspire nor ignite among themselves. --Onwa (talk) 14:11, 18 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

While my statement above stands as my rebuttal to a lot of the delete !votes that are actually calling for improvement or merge, it needs to be said that reliable sources very much disagree with you that these protests didn't inspire nor ignite among themselves. They're linked in the article if you want to learn something ;) Kingsif (talk) 23:31, 18 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Merge or Delete Of course some of these events are related. They're part of the march of history in which things are bound to be loosely connected. Some of the protests have more obvious connections, and some have more subtle connections. However, almost any series of events can be drawn into articles like this if an editor has such an inclination. I feel that merging into Latin American Spring may be the best idea to capture these events on a single article if it is really felt necessary or useful. Having said this, I note that the Latin American Spring page on the Spanish wiki was deleted.JohnmgKing (talk) 04:14, 21 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.