Talk:Marc Mac

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Expanding Marc Mac wiki article

Hello everyone! If anyone has the motivation I would love assistance in improving the Marc Mac article. His legacy is massive ! Much thanks I&I22 (talk) 02:18, 1 June 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Also no idea where these n/a categories came from???!!! I did not add them. Of course his legacy is extremely important and helped shaped both the UK edm music economy and contemporary edm music scene! Not sure how to fix those unwelcome additions. I&I22 (talk) 02:22, 19 June 2025 (UTC)[reply]

NA just means importance hasn't been rated yet (only articles are able to have ratings), it doesn't mean that these topics are unimportant :). GoldRomean (talk) 18:34, 20 June 2025 (UTC)[reply]

aha thank you! I&I22 (talk) 21:01, 24 June 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Citations for Marc Mac article

Books

Terzulli, Paul; Otchere, Eddie (2021). Who Say Reload: The Stories Behind the Classic Drum & Bass Records of the 90s. Velocity Press. pp. 14–18. ISBN 9781913231071
James, Martin (2020). State of Bass: the Origins of Jungle/Drum & Bass (2nd ed.). Velocity Press. ISBN 9781913231026.
Shapiro, Peter (1999). The Rough Guide to Drum 'n' bass. Rough Guides. pp. 71–75. ISBN 9781858284330.
Muggs, Joe; Stevens, Brian David (2020). Bass, Mids, Tops: An Oral History of Sound System Culture. Strange Attractor Press. ISBN 978-1907222771
Steven, Colin, ed. (2020). Knowledge Magazine 25 Year Anniversary. Velocity Press. ISBN 9781913231019.

I&I22 (talk) 21:36, 24 June 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Articles & Reviews

"The gentrification of jungle". Mixmag. Retrieved 2025-04-30.
Hermes, Will (1998-11-22). "Dance Music Enlists A New Sound: Voices". The New York Times. ISSN 0362-4331. Retrieved 2025-05-31.
Burgess, John (2007-01-19). "4hero, Play With the Changes". The Guardian. ISSN 0261-3077. Retrieved 2025-05-31.
published, Tim Cant (2013-11-05). "Marc Mac on getting back to his hardcore and DnB roots". MusicRadar. Retrieved 2025-06-25.
History of Harlesden". Brent Council. Retrieved 2025-04-29.
Brent Black Music History: A Photo Gallery Report". Black History Month 2025. 2008-02-14. Retrieved 2025-06-18.
Sigaud, J. (2020-10-13). "Black London, Harlesden Through The Lens". EDITIONS Black History Month, Magazines, Windrush 75, Newsletters & Publications©. Retrieved 2025-06-18.
"Starlight Records formed (late 1970s)". www.layersoflondon.org. Retrieved 2025-06-18.
"Black Cultural Archives". Google Arts & Culture. Retrieved 2025-06-25.
"Rewind: 4hero - Mr. Kirk's Nightmare · Single Review ⟋ RA". Resident Advisor. Retrieved 2025-06-01.
"Reinforced Records". daily.redbullmusicacademy.com
updated, Jim McCauley Contributions from Joe Foley last (2017-03-23). "14 of the best record label logos". Creative Bloq. Retrieved 2025-06-25.
UK, Drum and Bass. "Reinforced Records Drum and Bass Label Profile | Drum & Bass UK". Drum and Bass UK. Retrieved 2025-05-31.
"The History of Rock Music. 4 Hero: biography, discography, reviews, best albums, ratings". www.scaruffi.com. Retrieved 2025-05-31.
"Mentors: How 4Hero Programmed Goldie's Software". Telekom Electronic Beats. 2016-02-26. Retrieved 2025-05-31
"Music Review: 4hero - Play With The Changes". Tiny Mix Tapes. Retrieved 2025-04-29.
"Solid Gold: How 4Hero's 'Two Pages' predicted the future of d&b". DJ Mag. 2020-01-23. Retrieved 2025-05-31.

Interviews & Podcasts

"Marc Mac (4Hero) – Windrush Stories". UK Podcasts. Retrieved 2025-05-31.
"AN INTERVIEW WITH MARK 'MARC MAC'". Jungle Drum and Bass. 2017-01-20. Retrieved 2025-06-01.
Britt, King; Rodgers, Tara (April 2022). "'We Cross Examine with Old Sonic DNA': King Britt and Tara Rodgers in conversation on Blacktronika, music technology and pedagogy". Organised Sound. 27 (1): 55–58. doi:10.1017/S1355771822000231. ISSN 1355-7718.
"In Conversation with King Britt — Coloring Lessons". coloringlessons.com. Retrieved 2025-06-25.
"Goldie The Alchemist - BBC Sounds". www.bbc.co.uk. Retrieved 2025-06-25.

Did you know nomination

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Comment or view
Article history

)

~~... that Marc Mac is a British-Jamaican producer (one half of the group 4hero) whose album 'Two Pages' foretold the future sounds of drum 'n bass music?~~

Source: Cardew, Ben (2020). Solid Gold: How 4Hero's 'Two Pages' predicted the future of d&b. DJmag. https://djmag.com/features/solid-gold-how-4heros-two-pages-predicted-future-db

Reviewed:

Created by I&I22 (talk). Number of QPQs required: 0. Nominator has fewer than 5 past nominations.

I&I22 (talk) 16:10, 3 July 2025 (UTC).[reply]

New enough in mainspace and long enough. Nominator is QPQ-exempt. I don't think the hook works: it's puffery and unattributed. (The discography does not need a citation, though the detail on the labels and versions is probably excessive.) Look for a different fact, I&I22; I don't think this would be allowed to stand unless attributed to someone reasonably well-known. Sammi Brie (she/her · t · c) 18:58, 6 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Sammi Brie - i don't really understand what you are saying here. Do you mean to express that Marc Mac is not well known? this is not true and a wildly unsubstantiated statement. it is not at all "puffery and unattributed" where did you get that? why would i bother even making the article if he wasn't an important yet overlooked piece of music history - he is well known as a pioneering artist of jungle and d'n b.if you do a little research it is easy to see this. i have no idea what qpg is but i will look it up thank you and figure out citations etc. also i don't understand speaking like this to ppl volunteering their sweet irreplacable time and learning the ropes on wikipedia, "Look for a different fact,". i get it - directness and all that i - i don't mind directness - but it seems a bit abrasive. Anyways, maybe i just have misunderstood you? and am making assumptions as have often encountered aggressive, condescending, unkind, rude, assumptive, suspicious or impatient-sounding comments from other more experienced editors when i have made some newbie error. alrightee i am not on here to bicker but it is fun when the convo is more respectful especially when putting in the time to learn and participate. thanks again and will look into it — Preceding unsigned comment added by I&I22 (talk • contribs) 20:27, 6 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@I&I22: Please read WP:PUFFERY for more context. Generally speaking, Wikipedia wants to avoid subjective words like "pioneering" in articles, especially without proper attribution. It's more of a case of show than tell, i.e. show how the person is "pioneering", rather than saying they are so. Regarding the "well-known" thing, I think Sammi was talking about a reviewer or source that says Mac is "pioneering", rather than claiming that Mac is not well-known. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 00:10, 10 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Narutolovehinata5: I see. Thank you for the puffery reference. On my end I understand the word pioneering differently, less promotional I suppose. I am on a bit of a break from Wikipedia. Can either of you let me know if there is a deadline for the updates? Much thanks I&I22 (talk) 05:54, 10 July 2025 (UTC)I&I22[reply]

- Narutolovehinata5 is right. To make a claim like that requires appropriate backup, and big claims require lots of proof. That's a big claim. I'd be more than happy to help, but that's an important principle for editors to grasp. This sentence, for instance, has no reason to be there because it sounds so promotional: Reinforced Records has supported new musical genres and emerging artists, pioneering the sounds of 90's British dance music scene through mentorship, networking opportunities, collaboration and music production. Sammi Brie (she/her · t · c) 05:38, 10 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Sammi Brie: ok, great that is helpful to know. Yes there are many sources to cite. I can't remember what I wrote before, but I cited many academic references on his article. I have changed the dyk question, does that read better - in keeping with Wikimedia protocols? Marc Mac is in the main reference books for edm particularly British ones. He and his group members coached Goldie in crafting/translating his sonic visions for Goldie's epic masterpiece Timeless. Their label Reinforced Records mentored and supported many essential UK edm producers. As this artist seems to have shied away from promos due to racial unrest which led to family tragedies perhaps - they have kept a behind the scene profile but they are an essential part of British culture and mentioned often in Wikipedia so found it was important to mention them and provide a more accurate context for the other article mentions. I appreciate the support and guidance as i fail my way to greater understanding. I do not understand the Wikipedia culture completely yet and am duty-bound to represent the underacknowledged cultural contributions of BIPOC folx.:)

@Sammi Brie:

@Narutolovehinata5: Hello! I have no idea how to format my changes...I have edited directly into the code...does this work with these kinds of DYK projects? I understand now that my question was way too mundane!

@Sammi Brie: @Narutolovehinata5: I have updated this DYK - Marc Mac's parents were community activists and helped to found the Black Cultural Archives which I see currently has a project with Wikimedia UK! So exciting! woohooooo! I&I22 (talk) 12:13, 29 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]

ALT1: ... that the British-Jamaican producer (and one half of the EDM group 4hero) Marc Mac's parents were part of the community team that founded the Black Cultural Archives in London?

Google Arts & Culture: Black Cultural Archives, "A celebration of Black History is a celebration of British History" https://artsandculture.google.com/project/black-cultural-archives

- I've moved the new hook down so the original is still on the page. This is the first alternate hook or ALT1 in DYK parlance. This is a tough hook, I&I22, because it's about Marc's parents, not about Marc—which I don't think leads to a good hook about the subject. And I still have concerns about the tone and puffery. You can't make claims like "pioneering" etc. sourced to just one review. Sammi Brie (she/her · t · c) 17:40, 29 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Sammi Brie: ok great, am learning ha! ALT 1 rather than just delete, i understand now. Yes for sure am trying to avoid puffery but also he was an innovator so a pioneer, just a tricky vocabulary balance to manage!

Mentions of parents in the DYK archives do exist, the BCA is important history to know about and also it is interestingas is not common knowledge. For example, this is a DYK from January 15, 2025 "... that for television, James Mustapic set his mother up on a date with David Seymour, who will soon be the New Zealand deputy prime minister?"

Do the DYK's need more than one citation? There are many to choose from. This artist is cited in many places, including books on edm.

As I understand it the DYK's are interesting and also educational, which is my main goal with this one. I welcome feedback! Can keep trying. thanks again, I&I22 (talk) 17:50, 29 July 2025 (UTC) I&I22[reply]

That was still on something Mustapic did, which is not the case here. I still have some worries about the prose - do you have any sources on him and his role contributing to these genres that are not from individual reviews of works? As is I'm a bit concerned we are saying this so strongly sourced mostly to album reviews. PARAKANYAA (talk) 17:51, 30 July 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@I&I22: Please address the above. (For what it's worth, I'm a big fan of Tom & Jerry, both the cartoon and the band, and if I had my way we'd be running a hook beginning "that one half of Tom & Jerry...".)--Laun chba ller 14:40, 7 August 2025 (UTC)[reply]