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Valeri Lilov

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Valeri Lilov (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log • AfD statistics)
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Non-notable youth chess player, previously deleted at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Valeri Lilov. This is essentially the same article with somewhat more puffery, and the same external links from the body of the article formatted as references. While possibly impressive if you just glance at the wall of text in the "References" section without reading them, they are either trivial, primary sources, written by himself or his employers, or a combination of all three. The only reference that is independent and nontrivial is this, and if shaking hands with a sitting head of state met WP:BIO, I'd have an article too. Falls well short of WP:GNG, WP:BIO, and WP:ATHLETE. —Korath (Talk) 14:48, 19 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Dear Wikipedia Admins,

This is Wangshujuan, the creator of the article “Valeri Lilov.” After an extensive research on why my article was repeatedly declined to be published, another Wikipedia admin/associate told me to read through the official Wikipedia article on notability and find proofs on why my article is about a notable subject, whose information is proven by independent secondary sources. The admin also mentioned that my article is completely publishable by all Wikipedia rules and if he was responsible for it, he would definitely let it be published in its present form.

Here are a few proofs I took from the following Wikipedia page on Notability of people (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:BIO) which clearly define my subject, from the information provided in the article, as notable by Wikipedia standards.

1) “Basic Criteria: […] If the depth of coverage is not substantial, then multiple independent sources may be needed to prove notability; trivial coverage of a subject by secondary sources may not be sufficient to establish notability.”

The article ‘Valeri Lilov’ certainly does not provide one independent secondary source with deep coverage of his work and achievements in his field of tournament chess and private chess coaching, yet many secondary sources – websites with tournament final standings and short articles published on the internet regarding his awards in tournaments - do prove that he is a notable subject by the criteria described in the original Wikipedia passage cited above. (For more information please, review the references supporting Valeri Lilov’s tournament achievements in different countries.)

2) “Additional Criteria: […]

1. The person has received a well-known and significant award or honor, or has been nominated for one several times. “

Valeri Lilov has won a number of prestigious tournaments throughout Europe during his chess career so far and all the verifiable events won have been cited and properly supported with legit references on his proposed Wikipedia article. One of the most significant awards is that he became a European Champion in his age division (also cited).


3) “Creative Professionals: The person is regarded as an important figure or is widely cited by their peers or successors”

As seen from the references provided about Valeri Lilov chess coaching career, he is widely cited for his published works, two DVDs by ChessBase, and is also regarded as “important figure” – popular coach – by his peers and successors.

I hope these proves are enough to show why the “problematic” article ‘Valeri Lilov” is about a notable subject and should be created to be part of Wikipedia. Please, let me know if you need more proofs for notability or more precise citations from the actual article ‘Valeri Lilov’ itself. Please, take some time and review the many references provided to support this article’s information and you will be convinced of the legit notability of this person.

Thank you for your cooperation!

Sincerely,

Wangshujuan

Wangshujuan (talk) 15:20, 19 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]



The article for Valeri Lilov, currently nominated for deletion, provides a number of additional secondary sources, citing Valeri Lilov's achievements in different internationally recognized tournaments and competitions. The present references provide also an article, written in Bulgarian and translated into English via online translator, showing Valeri Lilov, receiving an award from the president of the Republic of Bulgaria. The contents of the article is carefully filtered from the previous deleted version and new information is added, as well, so that the new form of the article is properly verified statement by statement through each of the references given at the end of the article.

Wangshujuan

Wangshujuan (talk) 15:28, 19 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  • Comment - Much of the fuss relates to the fact that chess is considered a sport in Europe and a board game in America. One could argue for inclusion of this subject as clearing the ultra-low "pro athlete" bar and perhaps that is the right call. Carrite (talk) 17:45, 19 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    • The "have participated in a major international amateur or professional competition at the highest level such as the Olympics" criterion? There isn't even a claim that this individual has done so—those listed are far from the highest levels. —Korath (Talk) 18:17, 19 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep Valery Lilov is an innovative and already well-known chess trainer using the latest internet technology to coach chess players worldwide. Like Dan Heisman, Danny Kopec, Jeremy Silman, Yasser Seirawan or Arthur Yussupov he also provides high-level chess trainings on one-to-one as well as on top chess websites like chess.com, chessbase.com (DVDs) and many more. With his great pedagogic talent he is professional in teaching chess players on different levels. As he is already very present in the chess community I think that Wikipedia should present him as young up-coming chess player and already known chess trainer on his website. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.203.188.206 (talk) 19:52, 19 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Worthwhile addition. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.23.139.148 (talk) 04:11, 21 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  • Keep - Keep it. I have been in touch with Valery for some time during the last year and a half. I believe he's a pure person as well as a great chess player and a coach. He's really committed to diffuse the chess game around the world, specially on Internet. The article someone is looking to delete is just his real history and provides a background of what is his mission in chess playing and chess teaching.

--Dmncmm (talk) 10:00, 21 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  • Keep - The proposed Wikipedia article written for FIDE Master Valeri Lilov is strongly supported by his many achievements at such a young age. Contrary to some of the previous statements, many Wikipedia articles about FIDE Masters have been published successfully and it’s not only IMs and GMs who have place on Wikipedia. If you review the Wiki articles for the following FIDE Masters:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dennis_Monokroussos http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauri_Shankar http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dan_Heisman http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_De_La_Maza http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leontxo_Garc%C3%ADa you will be ashamed to claim that they are more notable people than FM Valeri Lilov. Why are they on Wikipedia and FM Valeri Lilov has to be deleted? I ask contributors who are also professional chess players to comment here. FM Valeri Lilov has many achievements (isn't European Champion a notable title?) both in his chess and coaching career and they’ve been achieved at such a young age. Isn’t that called “notable” for Wikipedia? Please, before deleting indiscriminately, check up what you have accepted in the past as notable.

Thanks, Alexis Alexis880507 (talk) 13:07, 21 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  • Keep it! FM Valeri Lilov is a great person. He has many great achievements in chess and chess coaching at such a young age. He is sharing his gift for chess with many others and helping those people benefit in their chess career. I don't see any reason to delete his Wikipedia profile because he is such a notable person. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.41.204.253 (talk)
  • Delete this article, although I do eye a possibility of a neutral article, by this, I mean an article based on sources independent of Mr. Lilov, not necessarily one which balances praise and criticism. As per Glenfarclas, the current article looks like a promotional piece, with all the sourcing being based on self-published commercial links. Articles like that are unfortunately detrimental to Wikipedia's aim to be a neutral and fair enyclopedia, unfettered by commercial interests. Now, Mr. Lilov's ChessBase DVDs on the Queen's Gambit Accepted and the Sicilian Kan Variation have been reviewed independently [1][2], and that independent reviewer agrees that Lilov is an excellent teacher, although he was less-than-impressed with the Kan DVD. If there is additional independent coverage of Lilov as a chess player (which would probably be in Bulgarian), beyond just tournament results, then there may be place for a biography on him. FM-strength is usually below what we expect for chess player bios though. While attaining the FM title at 16 is a very good achievement indeed, it is not an outstanding one, there are people who attained the much more exclusive grandmaster title at a considerably younger age. Sjakkalle (Check!) 14:36, 21 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • KEEP

Valeri Lilov is a very respected teacher and is known for his high quality and pedagogic way of teaching. After a thoroughly examination of your games he will send you the video recorded session as well homework.

There was mentioned that he does not give lectures and lessons for free; who does? Can you get a professional painter painting your house for free? There are dozens of teachers on Playchess.com and ICC, and NONE of them give lessons for free, so that is a strange, to say at least, comment to make.

As for his FM title, well, he has one, plus 2 IM norms.

And for his games, which as far as i know were also doubted to be real, a real chessplayer simply can check them on a database, in my case Chessbase 10.

All the allegations are therefore false, and if someone wants to say otherwise, i would be glad to reject them.

Yours sincerely,

Laotse1970 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Laotse1970 (talk • contribs) 15:19, 21 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

  • KEEP - This has the potential to be a strong article on a notable person. There many far weaker articles on far weaker topics on wikipedia KnightFireNC (talk) 16:16,2 21 July 2010 (UTC)
  • "KEEP"' Valeri Lilov is a respected Chess coach and respected Chess player. He is an ethical teacher and a kind person. In no way does his Wikipedia page/article infringe on any person or body. It should be kept for all to be aware of Valeri's love and appreciation for the chess community. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Earwax2010 (talk • contribs)
  • "KEEP"' Valeri is very qualified chess player and the chess trainer. His lectures and trainings-course on a game server playchess.com are very popular and make very big success among players of the most different level. I wish him success in all its undertakings! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Malysch (talk • contribs)
  • KEEP Valeri Lilov is an established chess coach and is thus significant enough to deserve his own wikipedia article. Since the facts about his playing career were also verifiable, I see no reason to delete the article. Phmilet (talk) 18:04, 21 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • KEEP Surely an established FIDE Master (easily verifiable) and coach with professional DVDs and a high standing in the chess world deserves an entry on Wikipedia. § —Preceding unsigned comment added by Placy (talk • contribs) 18:44, 21 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete Grand Master probably merits an article - Master not really. There are a lot of people at that level. (Been through this in another AfD...) Not happy about the promotional aspects of the article, either. Nor about the flock of socks sorry, the influx of single purpose accounts enthusing about the qualities of the subject without troubling themselves to read the policies of Wikipedia. Wikipedia is not a free webhost, no matter what some people think, and article status is governed by certain policies. OK, there are articles 'weaker' than this - go ahead and tag them. This isn't Pokemon - we can't catch 'em all. Not all at once, anyway.... The more of these SPAs that appear, the more I am usually convinced that an attempt is being made at gaming the system. A word of advice: This is NOT a vote by numbers. Peridon (talk) 19:23, 21 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep There is absolutely no reason to delete this page. There is no comparable chess coach using all the new internet technologies and beeing really dedicated to his students at the same time. At his young age he is allready training hundreds of chess players and i can't remember any other coach to do that at this age, not even in history! Saying Masters don't deserve an article on Wiki is complete nonsense especially if they are very good trainers. The strongest trainer in the world (Mark Dvoretzky) is "only" a Master and he deserves the article before most of the Grandmasters he trained. If there would be a rating for coaches Valeri Lilov definately would be Grand Master Level in there way before most GM's on Wikipedia. As for a chess player: He is still a youth player 2400+, one norm away from the IM-Title. In my opion he fits every demand to have a WIKI article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Gaskins de (talk • contribs) 19:36, 21 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep[3:09:16 PM] Amy Walker: Valeri Lilov is the chess coach--and player--I admire the most, above all others except perhaps my Uncle Wesley, who first taught me how to play and thus introduced me to this wonderful game! How high must someone reach, and how much must they accomplish, before they are deemed worthy of an article on an encyclopedia that ANYONE can edit? If I myself were to write a Wikipedia article about my chess accomplishments, that would be ludicrous because I have not made a name for myself in the chess world yet. Valeri has. He is a certified FIDE Master and legitimate chess tutor, and not some random "patzer" who posts poor-quality video chess lessons on YouTube without ANY formal ranking or ELO rating and expects people to follow his instructions. I owe this man EVERYTHING when it comes to who gets the credit for teaching me such great chess while being a fantastic player himself! If you wish Valeri to become a GM before he finds his way into the Wikipedia spotlight, I guarantee you that he'll get his norms before he's 25. If you delete this article, you delete an article about a maven! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Shakhmaty (talk • contribs) 20:17, 21 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep Valeri Lilov is a very bright talented young man who has the respect of chess players of all playing strengths world-wide. A FIDE Master and dedicated coach. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Charl.chess (talk • contribs) 21:07, 21 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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