Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/FAUST (programming language)

FAUST (programming language)

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FAUST was created at GRAME (Centre National de Creation Musicale). Their papers and talks thus do not constitute significant independent coverage. See discussion for ChucK for comparison. FuFoFuEd (talk) 17:48, 26 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Before someone accuses me of "deception" again, I know there's a tutorial on it at CCRMA, but it is WP:SPS. FuFoFuEd (talk) 18:17, 26 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

What is your concern about the Smith article? WP:SPS states an exception, "Self-published expert sources may be considered reliable when produced by an established expert on the topic of the article whose work in the relevant field has previously been published by reliable third-party publications." I'm not familiar with the subject but Smith gives credit for the creation of FAUST to "Yann Orlarey et al." so he appears to be independent and secondary and he also appears to be a previously published expert. I think this duplicates the other Smith citation, the one that did get published, meaning this is still just one source (i.e., one person saying something.) But if we hadn't had the other, I personally would have accepted this one. Msnicki (talk) 21:27, 26 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Keep It needs to be expanded, but I've added references that seem to establish notability. - SudoGhost™ 18:40, 26 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]
http://books.w3k.org/index.html W3K publishing published a grand total of 4 books, all by the same author, Julius Smith, who also wrote the CCRMA tutorial. And coverage in those books is minimal anyway. FuFoFuEd (talk) 18:46, 26 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Comment Publishing three books has no bearing on anything. Introduction to Digital Filters: With Audio Applications. has a section on Faust that is 16 pages long, hardly minimal. The Computer Music Association reference likewise covers it over the course of 4 pages. Neither of these are a "brief" mention by any stretch of the imagination. - SudoGhost™ 19:02, 26 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

SudoGhost, I'm confused. I found (what I thought was) Introduction to Digital Filters: With Audio Applications online and the section on FAUST sure doesn't look like 16 pages to me. Am I looking at the wrong thing? Msnicki (talk) 21:39, 26 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not sure if that's the same section (it refers to Appendix K, so I don't think so. But this is what I was referring to. It begins at page 417 and goes from there. - SudoGhost™ 21:42, 26 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not sure it matters much. Both the book by Smith published by W3K publishing and the tutorial by Smith on his CCRMA home page have practically the same content about FAUST. It's one source for all practical purposes. I don't know if a publisher that has published a grand total of four books (all of which penned by the same author) is anymore convincing than a self-published pdf. I agree that Smith is independent of the GRAME group though. FuFoFuEd (talk) 21:56, 26 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Weak delete. I just went through and fixed the citations, finding them all online and looking at them. Only one of the sources, the Smith book, is useful to establish notability and even it is quite short. The Orlarey et al paper is a primary source and not useful. The Lee book is such a brief mention as to make one wonder why anyone would bother citing it all. Right now, I think this subject fails the requirement for significant coverage by independent secondary sources required by WP:GNG. In my view, it still needs another article by an independent source that's really about FAUST to get it over the hurdle. Msnicki (talk) 20:54, 26 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]