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Sponcership

Hi do you offer sponcership to kids that have talent Nickikaiden (talk) 00:28, 19 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

New Junior Driver!

Brando Badoer is confirmed to be the new McLaren development driver in the junior program. He raced in the Italian Formula 4 with Ugo. 77.251.225.251 (talk) 13:01, 21 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Macau

@Thfeeder: The Macau Grand Prix is one single race. It is not a "title." This has been explained and fixed numerous times. Please stop adding it to the page. Thank you. Lazer-kitty (talk) 21:21, 9 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Lazer-kitty: I kindly urge you to cut down your condescending tone and edit warring, or external measures could be taken. Terms like "explained" or "fixed" are not appropriate here; we're here to discuss, not impose our views. The Macau Grand Prix is a stand-alone event that's awarded an FIA World Cup title since 2015. User:Thfeeder is not wrong to be adding this. MSport1005 (talk) 15:24, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@MSport1005: First off, apologize immediately for your insults above. These are completely uncalled for. You are the one who is edit warring, not me, and I have not been condescending at all. If you cannot discuss this without personal attacks then admins will need to be involved. Secondly, if you continue to re-add one single race as a title you will be reported for vandalism. This has been explained numerous times. It is not a title. If you'd like to change the standard for what counts as a title, feel free to discuss it here. You do not own the article and cannot make such decisions unilaterally. Lazer-kitty (talk) 15:54, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
And remember that Wikipedia encourages you to WP:BEBOLD, but if your bold changes are reverted, you are supposed to stop and discuss them. Both of you have utterly failed to do so, instead insisting that you own the page and can decide alone. Again, that's not how this works. And again, stop adding it and let's discuss it here like adults. Lazer-kitty (talk) 15:59, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@Lazer-kitty: There's no personal attacks. I got involved because of your attitude towards another user. I warned you about your tone and you've opted to escalate the situation. "if you continue to re-add one single race as a title you will be reported for vandalism" – this is not a game of threats. You do not WP:OWN the article and you do not impose your views without consensus. I urge you to discuss peacefully. Otherwise an incident report will be issued. MSport1005 (talk) 16:11, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@MSport1005: You accusing me of being condescending and edit warring are BOTH personal attacks that were completely unjustified and uncalled for. Again, you need to apologize for both of those claims immediately. I literally said please and thank you and you still claimed I was attacking people. That is absolutely unacceptable.
I do not think I WP:OWN the article, YOU do. I am simply enforcing the previously established consensus. YOU are the ones trying to impose your views without consensus. And AGAIN, if you'd like to change that consensus, the place is here. Not by edit warring.
So here's what I'd like you do to do: own up to your insults, apologize for them, no hard feelings. Stop edit warring and discuss your proposals here in good faith. Please. There is no need to approach this the way you have. Please. Lazer-kitty (talk) 16:24, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@Lazer-kitty: Pardon – I wasn't part of this – I literally came here to solve a conflict between two fellow users – and now you're telling me that I'm edit warring, vandalising and pretending to "own" the article? MSport1005 (talk) 16:33, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@MSport1005: Yes. You literally re-added Macau to the article without even including it in your edit summary, so yes, you are absolutely part of this, and you are absolutely edit warring, and you have falsely accused me of "imposing my beliefs on others" when I am doing the literal exact opposite of that. The consensus in these articles for years, and in other racing articles, has been to include only season-long racing series championships as "titles." I did not decide that, that's not "my belief," that's simply the way it's been done. If you guys would like to change that consensus, we need to a have a discussion about it, and I am more than happy to do so if you would simply WP:DROPTHESTICK and engage in a productive discussion about it. So far you have instead chosen to attack me and project your behaviors onto me, which is absolutely unacceptable. I don't like reporting users to the admins and I would strongly prefer if you would simply apologize, WP:DROPTHESTICK, and explain why you think one single race should be counted as a championship title. But I cannot stress enough: the very longtime consensus has been not to do so, and you cannot unilaterally change that consensus. WE change that consensus, together, by talking to each other and having a productive discussion. Not by reverting and attacking others. Lazer-kitty (talk) 16:41, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I am not edit warring – I reverted once and no further. You used terms like "explain" and "fix" above which usually don't reflect a willingness to discuss. You're warning others "if you continue to re-add one single race as a title you will be reported for vandalism". You're telling me to WP:DROPTHESTICK even though the current version of the page shows your preferred option. I've asked one and a thousand times to please discuss peacefully. Can we? MSport1005 (talk) 16:57, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@MSport1005: Yes, if you own up to your insults, apologize for them, and especially stop repeating them. I'm sorry if my original comment was confusing, I thought "please" and "thank you" would make my tone obvious, but you have egregiously misunderstood it. And no, the current version of the page once again has the race included as a title, by a random editor who has come out of nowhere to add it.
The consensus has never been to include Macau as a title, in any context. We need to return to that consensus and THEN discuss. Not keep finding new editors to re-add it. Lazer-kitty (talk) 17:02, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
"[...] by a random editor who has come out of nowhere to add it." Again, very unfortunate wording... MSport1005 (talk) 17:06, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
You keep saying you want to have a peaceful discussion yet you keep finding new ways to misunderstand me on purpose in order to make new accusations. I don't get it, man. I really don't. Why can't you just let it go? Why must you relentlessly attack me, over and over and over again? What have I done to you personally? If I've done something to wrong you under a previous account or something, I sincerely apologize, but I don't understand this. Lazer-kitty (talk) 17:09, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Road Atlanta Turn 5: Please undo your most recent change, it is against the consensus of these articles. Thanks. Lazer-kitty (talk) 16:56, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Could you show me the consensus that you're talking about? Just trying to see something as I haven't heard of anything regarding Macau. Thanks. Road Atlanta Turn 5 (talk) 17:01, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@Road Atlanta Turn 5: No, there is nothing to show. Consensus is usually established informally. You would need to show something new to explain why one single race should now be considered a title when it never has been before. Please, we just had a whole discussion about this, just remove it and then lets discuss it together. Lazer-kitty (talk) 17:03, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
"Consensus decision-making is a group decision-making process in which participants work together to achieve a broad acceptance."
I need some sort of proof that participants worked together to achieve a broad acceptance of the Macau GP not being a title, otherwise it's hearsay to me (definition of hearsay: "information received from other people which cannot be substantiated; rumour.") Road Atlanta Turn 5 (talk) 17:09, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
No you don't. Again, consensus is not always a formal process. The established standard of how a page is edited is the consensus, regardless of if it is actively discussed. If you want to change that, we need to have a discussion. If you do not revert it and express willingness to participate in that discussion, my only option will be to get the admins involved. This is not a threat, I don't want do that, I want to just chat among ourselves. But that cannot happen until the page is reverted. Lazer-kitty (talk) 17:12, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Consensus, Talk pages - "Consensus can be assumed if no editors object to a change" - I don't think consensus has been assumed as two editors have already objected to your idea.
Again, if some sort of consensus has been reached, I feel like proof is needed otherwise it's just hearsay to me as I haven't seen this being brought up anywhere else.
Feel free to link any other discussion where this topic was discussed to further illustrate me about it. Road Atlanta Turn 5 (talk) 17:18, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@Road Atlanta Turn 5:You are the ones making the change. Consensus was previously established and assumed based on single races never being included as titles. You are trying to change that and I am objecting. Please, I am begging you, just revert the change and let us discuss it together. Why are you forcing me to get admins involved when we could just discuss it? It should be so easy. If you think it should be included then revert it and explain why. Make a good point and I might agree with you. Let's do this productively and in good faith. Please. Lazer-kitty (talk) 17:24, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@Lazer-kitty: The fact that @Road Atlanta Turn 5 and @MSport1005 are making the changes doesn't necessarily mean they are in the wrong. If you are so sure of the fact that "Consensus was previously established and assumed based on single races never being included as titles", why not show us this consensus? The FIA mentions the Macau Grand Prix as a World Cup on their website, as well. SportscarFan2004 (talk) 17:28, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@SportscarFan2004: There is nothing to show but the articles themselves because consensus isn't always the result of a talk page discussion. I have already explained this. You are the ones who need to show why we would change that consensus, beyond simply adding something to the page that's never been there before. Lazer-kitty (talk) 17:31, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
"You are the ones making the change." 19 December 2024 - 14:08 suggests otherwise and rewatching the edit logs it seems like you are the only user with this idea so the "Consensus decision-making is a group decision-making process in which participants work together to achieve a broad acceptance" part doesn't seem to match up with what you're telling me.
Also you always keep ignoring the second half of my replies. I find it rude as it doesn't help resolve this situation and makes it go round and round in circles.
For the fourth time I'm asking if you could link any sort of consensus about Macau GP not being a title, otherwise it's hearsay.
My change was made to be consistent with other driver academy pages and the "Grand Prix" and "World Cup" names hold some weight as it isn't like any other races. Road Atlanta Turn 5 (talk) 17:35, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I have never once ignored any part of your comments. I have repeatedly explained that consensus is not always a talk page discussion, and that there is literally nothing to show you other than the articles themselves. You are the one ignoring that. Lazer-kitty (talk) 17:38, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
The articles I see have Macau Grand Prix under the section of "Titles as X junior" so I have no idea which articles you're referring to. Please illustrate me on the specific articles you're referring to so I can get a cleaner idea on it. Road Atlanta Turn 5 (talk) 17:48, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I am happy to engage in that discussion once this page has been returned to previously established consensus, which will allow us to discuss in good faith whether or not to make the proposed change. Otherwise, I would prefer to move forward with the ANI rather than to continue to argue here. Thanks. Lazer-kitty (talk) 17:58, 10 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
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