Help talk:Citation Style 1/Archive 87

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Archive 80

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Archive 85

access-date and Gale links

Is there any reason to include an access-date parameter if the only outbound link is a Gale ID generated thru Template:Gale? I'm getting the error message. My assumption is that there isn't a reason to include access-date because Gale is an archive and the content shouldn't change, but I thought I'd double check. ThadeusOfNazereth(he/him)^{Talk to Me!} 17:14, 18 December 2022 (UTC)

Please post the CS1 error message. Otherwise your assumption is correct. Citations of stable-link repositories such as Gale should not display an access date. 204.19.162.34 (talk) 21:09, 18 December 2022 (UTC)

The error message is "access-date without URL" - And thanks, that's what I figured. ThadeusOfNazereth(he/him)^{Talk to Me!} 23:43, 18 December 2022 (UTC)

CS1 maint: location

I was recently made aware that |location= and the like do not allow any digits to prevent misuse of the parameter, such as inserting page- and chapter numbers or unnecessary postal codes. But what if the number is essential to the location, say, 10 Downing Street? ~~lol1 VNIO (I made a mistake? talk to me) 21:19, 17 December 2022 (UTC)

Please link to an actual article where this need would be present. Without seeing an actual article, my guess is that |location=London would suffice. – Jonesey95 (talk) 21:40, 17 December 2022 (UTC)

Ref 133 of this article (permalink). I guess London does work but I think it's a bit of a shame that we can't be more specific. ~~lol1 VNIO (I made a mistake? talk to me) 21:46, 17 December 2022 (UTC); edited 22:08, 17 December 2022 (UTC)

Traditionally the location in a citation is the city of publication, which would just be London. We wouldn't list the address of the publisher.

If we're thinking about the original utterance of a speech as its publication, then the location would be where it was given, which is "Guildhall, London", not 10 Downing Street, and not the Prime Minister's Office. But in this case, you're citing a transcript published from elsewhere, so trying to be more specific is just confusing or inaccurate.

The publisher is the Prime Minister's Office, or 10 Downing Street if you want to use the residence as a metonym for the office (like The White House substitutes for the Executive Office of the President on this side of the pond). In short, your best option is |location=London |publisher=Prime Minister's Office. Imzadi 1979 → 23:20, 17 December 2022 (UTC)

Some older works do list addresses on the title page, although these were usually where they were to be sold. eg Sir John Oldcastle, the location is London, but the publishers part says, "Printed by V.S. for Thomas Panier, and areto be ſolde at his ſhop at the ſigne of the Catte and Parrots neere the Exchange."--Auric talk 18:38, 20 December 2022 (UTC)

Must translation parameters use the translations in the text?

When a text is published with a translation, must |trans-quote= and similar parameters use the translation in the text, or may an editor substitute a translation that she believes to be more accurate? This question is prompted by https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Hillel_the_Elder&curid=313892&diff=1125022169&oldid=1124176915, which I believe to be WP:OR. Either way, it would be helpful if the documentation of, e.g., |trans-title=, specified whether editors must respect the translations in the text. Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz Username:Chatul (talk) 14:50, 2 December 2022 (UTC)

Yes, use the text, Quotes should be verbatim. Editor interpolations are allowed only for context, for example when substituting a generic "he" in the quote with the actual name of the person/character. The translated title is part of the work's publication data and the citation's retrieval data. Should be entered as is at all times. 50.75.226.250 (talk) 16:05, 2 December 2022 (UTC)

Chatul, I run into this from time to time. First, let me just agree with the above; use the quote exactly as it appears. But it's possible to mitigate any ill effect, if you feel that it could be problematic. My response in similar situations depends on the severity of the problem. If it's just a poor translation, or an annoying issue such as false friends confusion that doesn't really interfere with understanding, then I just let it go. If I believe that the translation is inaccurate or ambiguous in a way that could affect the article or its verifiability, then I might add a Talk page section "Possibly inaccurate translation" or similar, and then add a {{clarify}} template to the article immediately after the citation and include the |reason= and |post-text= parameters, linking the template to the Talk section you just added. Mathglot (talk) 19:40, 22 December 2022 (UTC)

My issue was the opposite; there was an inline translation that I considered problematical, and I added English^[a] and Hebrew quotes directly from the text of the cited book rather than start an edit war over the translation in the body of the article. The other editor proceeded to change the |trans-quote= in the {{cite book}}; I view that as close to vandalism. --Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz Username:Chatul (talk) 20:26, 22 December 2022 (UTC)

Notes

^ The text used the word only, which was not in the Hebrew text, but enclosed it in brackets.

Wikilink and external link

I have come across an unusual situation where the book I want to cite has a Wikipedia article and there is an external source where the book can be viewed freely. Is there any way to link both the Wikipedia article and the external source in the citation? Obi2canibe (talk) 22:10, 20 December 2022 (UTC)

Only if the external source can be reached through a content-resolving identifier such as doi. The book article ideally should have an external url link to the book if one exists, and you can link the book article. Following the link, readers will eventually have access to the url. Alternately, use |url= and forgo |title-link=. 24.103.241.218 (talk) 22:33, 20 December 2022 (UTC)

A citation doesn't have to restrict itself to what citation templates provide. Adding (online) after the template will do what you want. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 01:39, 21 December 2022 (UTC)

Thank you both for your suggestions.--Obi2canibe (talk) 19:48, 22 December 2022 (UTC)

[1] The text used the word only, which was not in the Hebrew text, but enclosed it in brackets.

[a]