View source for Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Accessibility/Archive 8

{{aan}}

== Icon(s) to represent 'changed from/to' ==

I am building a [[User:Verbarson/sandbox|table]] of locomotive classes, represented by 4-digit numbers. Some classes were renumbered. So if the Class 3100 locomotives were renumbered as Class 5100, there would be two items in the relevant boxes in the table:
* 3100 ( > 5100)
* (3100 > ) 5100
The first would indicate that the 3100 class later changed to 5100, the second that the 5100 class had previously been 3100.
MOS says that I cannot use ASCII (eg '>') as an icon for accessibility reasons. How do I find an icon that says 'changed to' ? (And are the brackets a problem?)

--[[User:Verbarson|Verbarson]] ([[User talk:Verbarson|talk]]) 16:04, 10 February 2021 (UTC)
:{{replyto|Verbarson}} Those symbols (including the parentheses) will be read out fine by screen readers; their meaning would be unclear without an explanation though. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 07:04, 11 February 2021 (UTC)
::@Graham87 Thanks. I will provide a legend to explain the structure of the information, and the meaning of the symbols. --[[User:Verbarson|Verbarson]] ([[User talk:Verbarson|talk]]) 09:40, 11 February 2021 (UTC)

== Wikidata proposal for alt text property ==

There is a suggestion at [[wikidata:Wikidata:Property proposal/alt text]] to allow adding alt text to Commons images using Wikidata. Users with accessibility knowledge may wish to provide feedback. [[User:the wub|the wub]] [[User_talk:The wub|<span style="color: #008000">"?!"</span>]] 20:59, 22 February 2021 (UTC)

== Font gimmicks ==

I've started a discussion about disallowing "font gimmicks" site-wide as part of the MOS at [[Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Accessibility#Font gimmicks]]. I thought this WikiProject might be interested. [[User:Woodroar|Woodroar]] ([[User talk:Woodroar|talk]]) 00:50, 28 February 2021 (UTC)

== Accessibility of two video game list templates ==

Hi all, last night I added "caption" parameters to two templates that are often used for video game lists, {{tl|Video game titles}} and {{tl|Video game table}}. (Example lists: [[List of Blizzard Entertainment games]] for "titles", [[List of Mystery Dungeon video games]] for "table".) Another editor raised the point that the resulting output of these templates may be "layout tables" rather than "data tables" as per [[WP:DTAB]], as while they have row and column relationships they also do some things with visual layout. If  so, they should not get captions and are in fact contra-indicated altogether. Can anyone verify whether these template tables are actually parseable by screen readers, and if they should or should not get table captions? Thanks! --'''[[User:PresN|<span style="color:green">Pres</span>]][[User talk:PresN|<span style="color:blue">N</span>]]''' 16:02, 15 March 2021 (UTC)
:{{replyto|PresN}} Thanks for that. They parse fine here ... and I think they are indeed data tables because they have a consistent number of columns that display data in a tabular format. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 06:38, 16 March 2021 (UTC)
::{{replyto|Graham87}} Thanks you! I'll carry on with using captions for them then. --'''[[User:PresN|<span style="color:green">Pres</span>]][[User talk:PresN|<span style="color:blue">N</span>]]''' 13:59, 16 March 2021 (UTC)

== Precomposed fraction characters such as ¼ in category names ==

{{FYI|pointer=y}}
Please see: [[Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2021 March 3#Category:10¼ in gauge railways in England]] regarding the use of precomposed fraction characters such as ¼ in category names. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 23:37, 21 March 2021 (UTC)

== Relevant discussion at [[MOS:TABLE]] ==

{{FYI|pointer=y}}
Please see: [[Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Tables#Conflicting guidance on headers]], which concerns MOS guidance on "year" and "title" columns in tables (specifically, which column should be the rowheader, and the ordering of the two columns). — [[User:Goszei|Goszei]] ([[User_talk:Goszei|talk]])  06:36, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

== Solar System ignoring SMALLTEXT ==

[[:Solar System]] has a mix of {{tl|smaller}} and other formatting in the infobox that ignores [[:MOS:SMALLTEXT]]. [[User:Walter Görlitz|Walter Görlitz]] ([[User talk:Walter Görlitz|talk]]) 03:34, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
:{{done}} --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 16:52, 20 April 2021 (UTC)

== Discussion of [[Template:Life timeline]] and [[MOS:SMALLFONT]] ==

There is a discussion of how and whether to modify {{tl|Life timeline}} (a graphical timeline that shows the history of life over the last 4500 million years) to obey [[MOS:SMALLFONT|the accessibility guideline to avoid small fonts]]. You're welcome to join in the discussion [[Template talk:Life timeline#Original vs Test templates - comments welcome|here]]. — [[User:Hike395|hike395]] ([[User talk:Hike395|talk]]) 06:53, 14 May 2021 (UTC)

== RfC about the colour schemes used for professional wrestling navigational templates ==

{{fyi|pointer=y}} Please see [[Template talk:WCW World Television Championship#RfC about the colour schemes used for professional wrestling navigational templates]]. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 20:58, 4 June 2021 (UTC)

== Blank lines before stub templates? ==

I have a question - I may have misread the Accessibility MOS, but outside of lists, does leaving doubled-up blank lines between, say, categories and then stub templates impact accessibility?

I removed them [[Special:Diff/1034218893|here]], but this was then [[Special:Diff/1034369251|reverted]], with the explanation that it's standard practice to leave that gap between templates.

Have I misread the MOS and thought that double blank lines anywhere impacts reading as a blank line in a list would do? I'd appreciate some input. Thanks! --[[User:Ineffablebookkeeper|Ineffablebookkeeper]] ([[User talk:Ineffablebookkeeper|talk]]) 17:13, 19 July 2021 (UTC)
:{{replyto|Ineffablebookkeeper|Peter coxhead}} It's not within a list, and it doesn't affect accessibility. The only difference is that the two-blank-line format emits the HTML <syntaxhighlight lang=html><p>
  <br>
</p></syntaxhighlight> which is absent from the one-blank-line format, and I'm certain that screen readers will take this in their stride.
:At one time the second blank line was necessary for certain bots and scripts to correctly detect the stub template, but I believe that this is no longer the case; but [[WP:STUBSPACING]] still suggests two blank lines. Personally speaking, if there are no blank lines, I add one; if there are three or more, I remove sufficient to leave two; if there are one or two, I leave them alone. It's really not worth [[WP:EW]]ing about. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 19:02, 19 July 2021 (UTC)
::{{ping|Redrose64|Ineffablebookkeeper}} [[WP:STUBSPACING]] is a guideline, so I suppose you can say "suggests" but it's written as an instruction: {{tq|Leave two blank lines between the first stub template and whatever precedes it.}} It's certainly not something to edit war about, we agree; I reverted to make the point that editors should not be changing two blank lines here to one. [[User:Peter coxhead|Peter coxhead]] ([[User talk:Peter coxhead|talk]]) 21:49, 19 July 2021 (UTC)
:{{reply|Peter coxhead}}, {{reply|Redrose64}} - I agree, this isn't something to edit war about, and I'm if I came off as snarky - my point was more along the lines of me not always having the best grasp of Wikipedia's many guidelines(!). I wanted to make sure I was going about with best practice, so I figured I'd ask. -- [[User:Ineffablebookkeeper|Ineffablebookkeeper]] ([[User talk:Ineffablebookkeeper|talk]]) 21:53, 19 July 2021 (UTC)
::{{ping|Ineffablebookkeeper}} I'm not sure if any editor can ever grasp all of the English Wikipedia's many guidelines; I certainly wouldn't claim to have done so after getting on for 12 years of editing! Two blank lines before a stub template just happens to be one that I do remember, probably because I often create stubs. [[User:Peter coxhead|Peter coxhead]] ([[User talk:Peter coxhead|talk]]) 22:00, 19 July 2021 (UTC)
:::Not a problem! I wonder if we couldn't have some sort of Olympics for remembering Wikipedia guidelines...special points given out for Ye Olde Wikipedian Guidelines, of course.(!) -- [[User:Ineffablebookkeeper|Ineffablebookkeeper]] ([[User talk:Ineffablebookkeeper|talk]]) 22:03, 19 July 2021 (UTC)
::::{{replyto|Ineffablebookkeeper}} Leaving [[WP:INDENTGAP|blank lines in lists]], as you did {{diff|Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Accessibility|prev|1034442806|here}}, ''does'' cause accessibility issues. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 22:32, 19 July 2021 (UTC)
:::::Ah, right you are - apologies. -- [[User:Ineffablebookkeeper|Ineffablebookkeeper]] ([[User talk:Ineffablebookkeeper|talk]]) 10:53, 20 July 2021 (UTC)
:::::Hold on - curious thing is, {{reply|Redrose64}}, I didn't actually *enter* a blank line there manually. It seems that leaving a reply on mobile automatically inserts one - having just gone to desktop view on mobile for this edit, I can see that it added a blank line to every reply entered on mobile.
:::::Which seems odd. There's a lot of oddities of mobile editing, but it seems to presume a list formatting without the user's involvement. Seems like an issue that could need fixing, tbh. --[[User:Ineffablebookkeeper|Ineffablebookkeeper]] ([[User talk:Ineffablebookkeeper|talk]]) 10:58, 20 July 2021 (UTC)

== Are the graphs in [[Greenhouse gas emissions by Turkey]] OK? ==

Hello,

Could any of you guys check them as I will be putting the article in for FAC very soon and have had a comment from my FA mentor at [[Talk:Greenhouse_gas_emissions_by_Turkey#Pre-FA_thoughts]]?

If you are pressed for time please let me know first about the graph in [[Greenhouse_gas_emissions_by_Turkey#Mitigation]]

Thanks in advance

[[User:Chidgk1|Chidgk1]] ([[User talk:Chidgk1|talk]]) 08:44, 15 September 2021 (UTC)
:I didn't even look at the graphs, the most glaringly obvious accessibility issue on that thread was the massive disregard for [[WP:LISTGAP]], which I have fixed. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 20:52, 15 September 2021 (UTC)

::Thank you so much for fixing that. As I hope to get the article to FA if anyone can spot any accessibility issues at all I would be most grateful if you could ping me. [[User:Chidgk1|Chidgk1]] ([[User talk:Chidgk1|talk]]) 06:42, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

==Discussion at [[:Talk:List of screw drives#Images in Section Headings|Talk:List of screw drives §&nbsp;Images in Section Headings]]==
[[File:Symbol watching blue lashes high contrast.svg|25px|link=|alt=]]&nbsp;You are invited to join the discussion at [[:Talk:List of screw drives#Images in Section Headings|Talk:List of screw drives §&nbsp;Images in Section Headings]]. — [[User:Marchjuly|Marchjuly]] ([[User talk:Marchjuly|talk]]) 04:13, 15 October 2021 (UTC)<!-- [[Template:Please see]] -->

== Discussion about bot to fix indentations in discussions ==

{{fyi|pointer=y}} Please see [[WP:BOTREQ#Bot to fix indents]]. – [[User:SD0001|<span style="font-weight: bold; color: #C30">SD0001</span>]] ([[User talk:SD0001|talk]]) 07:56, 11 October 2021 (UTC)

:The bot is now undergoing trials. See [[Wikipedia:Bots/Requests for approval/IndentBot]]. [[User:Notsniwiast|Winston]] ([[User talk:Notsniwiast|talk]]) 23:29, 22 October 2021 (UTC)

==Discussion at [[:Wikipedia talk:WikiProject California#Navbox color|Wikipedia talk:WikiProject California §&nbsp;Navbox color]]==
[[File:Symbol watching blue lashes high contrast.svg|25px|link=|alt=]]&nbsp;You are invited to join the discussion at [[:Wikipedia talk:WikiProject California#Navbox color|Wikipedia talk:WikiProject California §&nbsp;Navbox color]].  <span style="color:#AAA"><small>&#123;{u&#124;</small><span style="border-radius:9em;padding:0 5px;background:#088">[[User:Sdkb|<span style="color:#FFF">'''Sdkb'''</span>]]</span><small>}&#125;</small></span> <sup>[[User talk:Sdkb|'''talk''']]</sup> 02:41, 23 October 2021 (UTC)<!-- [[Template:Please see]] -->

==Discussion at [[:Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Weather#RfC: Changing the color scheme for storm colors to make it more accessible|Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Weather §&nbsp;RfC: Changing the color scheme for storm colors to make it more accessible]]==
[[File:Symbol watching blue lashes high contrast.svg|25px|link=|alt=]]&nbsp;You are invited to join the discussion at [[:Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Weather#RfC: Changing the color scheme for storm colors to make it more accessible|Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Weather §&nbsp;RfC: Changing the color scheme for storm colors to make it more accessible]].  <span style="background:#ffff55">'''''[[User:Chlod|Chlod]]'''''</span>&nbsp;<small style="font-size:calc(1em - 2pt)">([[User talk:Chlod|say hi!]])</small> 17:52, 17 November 2021 (UTC)<!-- [[Template:Please see]] -->

== "This is not a paywall" paywall ==

I don't know where to tell people this so here it goes.

The paywall that says "This is not a paywall" takes up an enormous amount of the screen for people with disabilities who have to scale up.

I wouldn't be caught dead giving Wikipedia money as I'd rather it be broken up into a dozen or more smaller wikis so that no one of them gets the massive undue political influence Wikipedia wields in society, mostly for evil. But I thought someone would like to know before we get start getting browser extensions specifically designed to disable Wikipedia nagging. --[[Special:Contributions/2601:300:4080:6230:441A:91B:9FF:7BDD|2601:300:4080:6230:441A:91B:9FF:7BDD]] ([[User talk:2601:300:4080:6230:441A:91B:9FF:7BDD|talk]]) 00:44, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

== Suggestions please - re Australian Government structure diagram ==

Any suggestions please for improving accessibility of the following diagram:

<imagemap>
File:Au_gov_chart.svg|thumb|center|640px|Structure of the Government of Australia|alt=A high level diagram of the structure of the Government of Australia, the three branches, legislative, executive, and judicial.
rect 575 6 1175 56 [[Constitution of Australia]]

rect 575 191 1175 241 [[Governor General of Australia]]

rect 125 341 425 391 [[Legislature|Legislative Banch]]
rect 725 341 1025 391 [[Executive (government)|Executive Branch]]
rect 1325 341 1625 391 [[Judiciary|Judicial Branch]]
	
rect 25 491 525 541 [[Parliament of Australia]]

rect  25 542 275 642 [[House of Representatives (Australia)|House of Representatives]]
rect 275 542 525 642 [[Australian_Senate|Senate]]

rect 625 491 1125 541 [[Federal Executive Council (Australia)|Federal Executive Council]]
rect 625 542 875 642 [[List of Australian ministries|Current Ministers]]
rect 875 542 1125 642 [[List of Australian ministries|Previous Ministers]]

rect 1225 491 1725 541 [[High_Court_of_Australia|High Court of Australia]]

rect 623 743 873 843 [[List of Australian Government entities|Government Departments]]

rect 1225 642 1725 692 [[Judiciary_of_Australia#Federal_courts|Other federal courts]]
</imagemap>

Regards.  [[User:Aoziwe|Aoziwe]] ([[User talk:Aoziwe|talk]]) 13:00, 12 December 2021 (UTC)
:The accessibility seems OK to me as a totally blind person. However, I fixed the typos in the image description where it's used at [[Politics of Australia]] and [[Australian Government]]. These typos [[WP:TALK#REVISE|shouldn't be corrected]] in other places, however. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 14:04, 12 December 2021 (UTC)
:: Thanks [[User:Graham87|Graham]].  I have fixed the typo in the diagram too.  [[User:Aoziwe|Aoziwe]] ([[User talk:Aoziwe|talk]]) 03:49, 13 December 2021 (UTC)

== Request for bot fix to contrast issue on awards pages ==

{| class="wikitable" style="float: right; width: auto; margin-left: 1em;"
|+ Example colour contrast
!
! scope="col" | Blue 
! scope="col" | Wheat 
|- style="color: #ba0000;"
! scope="row" | Red (Vector legacy)
| style="background-color: #b0c4de;" | Red 3.82:1
| style="background-color: #f5deb3;" | Red 5.17:1
|- style="color: #dd3333;"
! scope="row" | Red (Vector new)
| style="background-color: #b0c4de;" | Red 2.56:1
| style="background-color: #f5deb3;" | Red 3.47:1
|- style="color: #0645ab;"
! scope="row" | Blue text
| style="background-color: #b0c4de;" | Blue 4.79:1
| style="background-color: #f5deb3;" | Blue 6.49:1
|-
! scope="row" | Black text
| style="background-color: #b0c4de;" | Black 11.79:1
| style="background-color: #f5deb3;" | Black 15.98:1
|}

Having done some work on some of the [[Hugo Award]] winners today, I've noticed that the winners are highlighted with a blue background of <code>#b0c4de</code> <span style="border: solid 1px #c0c0c0; background-color: #b0c4de;">&emsp;</span>, which has a contrast ratio of 3.82:1 for red links, 4.79:1 for blue links and 11.79:1 for black text — [https://webaim.org/resources/contrastchecker/ WebAIM's Contrast Checker] tells me that's a WCAG AA fail for red, a narrow AA pass (and AAA fail) for blue text and a AAA pass for black. (To save anyone looking it up, "normal text" should be 4.5:1 or greater for AA, 7:1 for AAA.)

Having not checked the numbers but merely found it very difficult to read, I [[WP:BOLD|boldly]] changed the background to <code>#f5deb3</code> <span style="border: solid 1px #c0c0c0; background-color: #f5deb3;">&emsp;</span>, the named HTML colour "wheat", which is a WCAG AA pass for all 3 colours (but still a AAA fail for red and blue). Not unreasonably, someone reverted my change with a comment of "{{talk quote inline|keep consistent style across all hugo pages}}".

(I've added the redlink colour for both the legacy Vector skin and the newer Vector skin to the table above. Note that, while new Vector uses a brighter redlink colour of <code>#dd3333</code> <span style="border: solid 1px #c0c0c0; background-color: #dd3333;">&emsp;</span>, the only AA-passing yellowish background for that red would be <code>#ffffee</code> <span style="border: solid 1px #c0c0c0; background-color: #ffffee;">&emsp;</span>, which is barely distinguishable from white or from the background <code>#f8f9fa</code> <span style="border: solid 1px #c0c0c0; background-color: #f8f9fa;">&emsp;</span> of the rest of the table rows. As a result, I am not recommending that colour.)

Could someone with a bot or [[WP:AWB|AutoWikiBrowser]] go through the articles for these awards (all the pages within the primary category [[:Category:Hugo Awards]] and also the pages within [[:Category:Nebula Awards]], in both cases non-recursively) and change <code>#b0c4de</code> to <code>#f5deb3</code> (as a case-insensitive match), please? — <span class="vcard"><span class="fn">[[User:OwenBlacker|OwenBlacker]]</span> <small>(he/him; [[User talk:OwenBlacker|Talk]]; please &#123;&#123;[[Template:ping|ping]]&#125;&#125; me in replies)</small></span> 20:36, 19 December 2021 (UTC)

== Maps ==

Are there any considerations for maps other than those covered at [[MOS:COLOR]]? ◅&nbsp;[[User:SebastianHelm|Sebastian]] 13:10, 20 December 2021 (UTC)

== Discussion about redirects and typos ==

Hi, there's [[Wikipedia talk:Criteria for speedy deletion#rfc_F12528C|an RfC at Wikipedia talk:Criteria for speedy deletion]] about having typos as redirects. I don't understand redirects well enough to make an actual comment at the RFC, but I am notifying here because typing error and spelling error redirects are going to be most helpful to people with disability. --[[User:Xurizuri|Xurizuri]] ([[User talk:Xurizuri|talk]]) 04:13, 9 February 2022 (UTC)

== [[:Template:Yes]] has an [[WP:RFC|RFC]]==

<div class="floatleft" style="margin-bottom:0">[[File:Ambox warning orange.svg|48px|alt=|link=]]</div>'''[[:Template:Yes]]''' has an RFC for possible consensus. A discussion is taking place. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments on the '''[[Template talk:Yes#RfC on the colour of Template:No (more options)|discussion page]]'''.<!-- Template:Rfc notice--> Thank you. --[[User:Ftrebien|Fernando Trebien]] ([[User talk:Ftrebien|talk]]) 20:15, 20 February 2022 (UTC)

== Blank lines following section headings ==

{{fyi|pointer=y}} Please see [[Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style#Spacing RfC]]. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 22:34, 20 February 2022 (UTC)

==Discussion at [[:Template talk:Edit taxonomy#Pencil icon, 2022|Template talk:Edit taxonomy §&nbsp;Pencil icon, 2022]]==
[[File:Symbol watching blue lashes high contrast.svg|25px|link=|alt=]]&nbsp;You are invited to join the discussion at [[:Template talk:Edit taxonomy#Pencil icon, 2022|Template talk:Edit taxonomy §&nbsp;Pencil icon, 2022]].  <span style="color:#AAA"><small>&#123;{u&#124;</small><span style="border-radius:9em;padding:0 5px;background:#088">[[User:Sdkb|<span style="color:#FFF">'''Sdkb'''</span>]]</span><small>}&#125;</small></span> <sup>[[User talk:Sdkb|'''talk''']]</sup> 10:04, 9 March 2022 (UTC)<!-- [[Template:Please see]] -->

== Discussion at [[Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Weather]] ==

There is a discussion at [[Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Weather#Newest_Proposal_Yet|WikiProject Weather]] regarding the accessibility of track maps, templates/infoboxes, and timelines for the colorblind community. Feedback would be appreciated. [[User:Hurricane Noah|<span style="white-space:nowrap;text-shadow:#009200 0.3em 0.4em 1.0em,#009200 -0.2em -0.2em 1.0em;color:#009200"><b>Noah</b></span>]]<sup>[[User talk:Hurricane Noah|<span style="color:#ff0000"><b>Talk</b></span>]]</sup> 22:04, 21 March 2022 (UTC)

== Discussion about all-caps text at Talk:The Masked Singer (American season 4) ==

There's the start of a discussion at [[Talk:The Masked Singer (American season 4)#All-caps in table]].

The table looks like this (I've redacted names to avoid spoilers)

{| class="wikitable" style="text-align:center; "
|+ Results
|- 
! rowspan="3"| Stage name
! rowspan="3"| Celebrity
! rowspan="3"| Occupation(s)
! colspan="11"| Episodes
|-
! 1
! 2
! 3
! 4
! 5
! 6
! 7
! 8
! 9
! rowspan="2"|10
! rowspan="2"|12
|-
! Group A<!--Do not remove Group. It makes the heading clearer to readers the first time each group letter appears.-->
! Group B<!--Do not remove Group. It makes the heading clearer to readers the first time each group letter appears.-->
! A
! B
! colspan="2"| Group C<!--Do not remove Group. It makes the heading clearer to readers the first time each group letter appears.-->
! A
! B
! C
|-
! (redacted)
| (redacted)
| (redacted)
| bgcolor=lightgreen | SAFE
| bgcolor=#FFEBCD|
| bgcolor=lightgreen | SAFE
| bgcolor=#FFEBCD|
| bgcolor=#FFEBCD|
| bgcolor=#FFEBCD|
| bgcolor=#F888FD | WIN
| bgcolor=#FFEBCD|
| bgcolor=#FFEBCD|
| bgcolor=#F888FD | WIN
| bgcolor=gold | '''WINNER'''
|-
! (redacted)
| (redacted)
| (redacted)
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="lightgreen" | SAFE
| bgcolor="lightgreen" | SAFE
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="#F3F781" | RISK
| bgcolor="#F888FD" | WIN
| bgcolor=silver | RUNNER-UP
|-
! (redacted)
| (redacted)
| (redacted)
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="lightgreen" | SAFE
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="lightgreen" | SAFE
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="lightgreen" | SAFE
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="#F888FD" | WIN
| bgcolor=tan | THIRD
|-
! (redacted)
| (redacted)
| (redacted)
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="lightgreen" | SAFE
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="lightgreen" | SAFE
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="lightgreen" | SAFE
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor=salmon | OUT
| bgcolor=darkgrey |
|-
! (redacted)
| (redacted)
| (redacted)
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="lightgreen" | SAFE
| bgcolor="lightgreen" | SAFE 
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="#FFEBCD" |
| bgcolor="#F888FD" | WIN
| bgcolor=salmon | OUT
| bgcolor=darkgrey |
|-
! (redacted)
| (redacted)
| (redacted)
| bgcolor=lightgreen | SAFE
| bgcolor=#FFEBCD|
| bgcolor=lightgreen | SAFE
| bgcolor=#FFEBCD|
| bgcolor=#FFEBCD|
| bgcolor=#FFEBCD|
| bgcolor= #F3F781 | RISK
| bgcolor=#FFEBCD|
| bgcolor=#FFEBCD|
| bgcolor=salmon | OUT
| bgcolor=darkgrey |
|}

I'm not wild about the colour contrast, which could certainly be improved, but I find all-caps text difficult to read, so that's what caught my attention.

If you'd like to engage in the discussion, please do so there. — <span class="vcard"><span class="fn">[[User:OwenBlacker|OwenBlacker]]</span> <small>(he/him; [[User talk:OwenBlacker|Talk]]; please &#123;&#123;[[Template:ping|ping]]&#125;&#125; me in replies)</small></span> 10:08, 26 March 2022 (UTC)

== Discussion regarding map colours on 2022 Russian invasion of Ukraine ==

Just thought I'd alert the WikiProject to this [[Talk:2022_Russian_invasion_of_Ukraine#Map_is_useless_for_color-blind_people]]. — '''[[User:Czello|<i style="color:#8000FF">Czello</i>]]''' 09:16, 2 April 2022 (UTC)

== The Convert template and fractional values ==

{{fyi|pointer=y}} Please see [[Talk:East Lancashire Railway#The convert thing]]. This concerns how screen readers call out constructs like {{convert|12+1/2|mi|km|0|adj=on}}. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 11:55, 5 April 2022 (UTC)

== Feedback request at [[Talk:2022 Russian invasion of Ukraine#Changing the main map to the colourblind-friendly version]] ==

Hi all. I would like to invite editors from [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Accessibility]] to offer their feedback in the discussion [[Talk:2022 Russian invasion of Ukraine#Changing the main map to the colourblind-friendly   version]]. Thanks! [[User talk:Melmann|<strong><span style="font-family:Segoe UI Semilight ; background-color: #ffd166; padding: 1px;"><span style="color: #ef476f;">Mel</span><span style="color: #8c8757;">ma</span><span style="color: #118ab2;">nn</span></span></strong>]] 18:02, 19 April 2022 (UTC)

== Discussion at Wikipedia:Edit filter/False positives/Reports § Hegelaci ==

There's a discussion at [[Wikipedia:Edit filter/False positives/Reports#Hegelaci|Wikipedia:Edit filter/False positives/Reports § Hegelaci]] about [http://simplyaccessible.com/article/better-for-accessibility/ off-left] tripping an edit filter about absolute positioning. WikiProject participants may wish to contribute there. — <span class="vcard"><span class="fn">[[User:OwenBlacker|OwenBlacker]]</span> <small>(he/him; [[User talk:OwenBlacker|Talk]]; please &#123;&#123;[[Template:ping|ping]]&#125;&#125; me in replies)</small></span> 10:18, 2 May 2022 (UTC)

== Feedback requested – attempted addition of screen-reader compatibility to {{tl|Scarf}} ==

I was trying to work out how to add alt text to the {{tl|Scarf}} template which produces a visual representation of an academic scarf. Because it's implemented as a table, to allow for taking up variable width, editor-specified colours etc. (even though it acts more like an image) it doesn't have an alt attribute.

The solution I came up with was a "description" parameter which, if used, renders the provided text as a screenreader-only snippet and adds the {{code|<nowiki>aria-hidden="true"</nowiki>}} attribute to the table. The intent is for screenreaders to completely ignore the table and just read a hidden description of the pattern.

I've added descriptions to some of the built-in patterns. Here is how they appear:

Newnham College—
{{Scarf/University of Cambridge |width=25% |Newnham}}

King's College—
{{Scarf/University of Cambridge |width=25% |King's}}

Jesus College—
{{Scarf/University of Cambridge |width=25% |Jesus 2-sided}}

Is that an improvement? To me, when I turn my screenreader on it now describes the pattern and doesn't cause any unanticipated issues. But I don't ordinarily use a screenreader so I would like some feedback from those who do on whether this is a helpful change before adding any more descriptions. [[User:Charlie Awesome|Charlie A.]] ([[User talk:Charlie Awesome|talk]]) 15:11, 13 May 2022 (UTC)
:{{replyto|Charlie A.}} Thanks, that's much better! There is actually a template for this kind of situation, {{tl|Screen reader-only}}, which could be more appropriate (but I don't really know what the advantages/disadvantages are between your approach and the templates'). The pseudo-alt text reads fine in both the Windows screen readers I have here. I had no idea about the existence of the scarf template before, let alone its previous inaccessibility. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 08:39, 14 May 2022 (UTC)
:{{replyto|Charlie Awesome}} Redoing ping. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 08:40, 14 May 2022 (UTC)
::Great, glad it works as expected for you too. I actually used {{tl|Screen reader-only}} within the scarf template to generate the snippet that gets read, so glad I'm using it correctly – was slightly concerned this was too much of a fudge/wasn't applied correctly. Not surprised you've not come across the scarf template, it's used on very niche subset of articles! Time to write some more descriptions... (cf [[Academic scarf]]) [[User:Charlie Awesome|Charlie A.]] ([[User talk:Charlie Awesome|talk]]) 09:13, 14 May 2022 (UTC)

== Emojis do not display in some Chrome browsers ==

While searching wikipedia for a strange blank box character appearing on some web pages, I saw that the [[Emoji]] page was not rendering all the emojis on Google Chrome (apparently a known deficiency).
I then added [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Emoji#Emojis_do_not_display_in_some_Chrome_browsers this] to the talk page:

<nowiki>== Emojis do not display in some Chrome browsers ==</nowiki>

In the section "Emoji versus text presentation", Google Chrome on Windows 8 renders the first emoji character as a blank box. In Firefox it renders as expected. Should Wikipedia add an image to avoid confounding the reader? I.e., should wikipedia pages be accessible to the widest variety of users, and not merely those with the latest versions of browsers and operating systems? -[[User:84user|84user]] ([[User talk:84user|talk]]) 12:11, 18 June 2022 (UTC)

-[[User:84user|84user]] ([[User talk:84user|talk]]) 12:33, 18 June 2022 (UTC)
:{{reply-to|84user}} it's annoying that emojis aren't universal across browsers and operating systems; however, we do have [[MOS:ICON]], which "encompasses any small images – including logos, crests, coats of arms, seals, flags – or other decoration, whether produced by small image files, typographic dingbats, emojis, or CSS display manipulation".
:It's typically good practice to use emojis, and any other icons, as sparingly as possible for reasons of display and accessibility. As far as I know, emojis themselves aren't considered suitable for use in article text unless it's unavoidable, and they're covered under [[MOS:ICON]].--[[User:Ineffablebookkeeper|Ineffablebookkeeper]] ([[User talk:Ineffablebookkeeper|talk]]) (&#123;&#123;[[Template:ping|ping]]&#125;&#125; me!) 13:23, 18 June 2022 (UTC)
::What gets displayed (or read out by screen readers) will depend upon several factors, such as: the operating system; installed fonts; the browser and version. For example, the small red rose in my sig displays in three different ways on my two PCs and my mother's laptop, all using Firefox but different versions of Windows. Opera just shows a blank rectangle.
::One advantage of emojis over images is size. The one in my signature occupies just seven bytes, I know of none that exceed ten. PNG images, on the other hand, will be a ''minimum'' of 69 bytes - and that's for just one pixel. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 20:26, 18 June 2022 (UTC)

== discussion at [[Template talk:Fraction]] ==

There's a discussion at [[Template talk:Fraction#Fractions are not readable with screen readers or virtual assistants]]. [[User:KaraLG84|KaraLG84]] ([[User talk:KaraLG84|talk]]) 13:01, 14 July 2022 (UTC)

== [[Module:RoundN]] background colors ==

A discussion was started at [[Module talk:RoundN#Medal colors for gold/silver/bronze|Module talk:RoundN § Medal colors for gold/silver/bronze]], aiming to change the module's background colors in favor of more accessible ones. Please, join us in it, as we lack experience in the subject. [[User:CLalgo|CLalgo]] ([[User talk:CLalgo|talk]]) 13:22, 18 July 2022 (UTC)

== Question about how screen readers handle List of presidents of the United States ==

Hi, a question came up at the [[Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/List of presidents of the United States/archive1|FLC]] for [[List of presidents of the United States]]. Specifically, several of the cells in the table use "<nowiki>----</nowiki>" (which results in a horizontal line) as a separator between multiple items in a single cell, such as if a single president had two terms, then the "election" column has two items separated by that line. Can anyone tell us how screen readers handle these cells? Is it intelligible? Thanks! --'''[[User:PresN|<span style="color:green">Pres</span>]][[User talk:PresN|<span style="color:blue">N</span>]]''' 18:01, 30 July 2022 (UTC)
:I've replied there. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 03:20, 31 July 2022 (UTC)

== Template grc-transl ==

I just came across {{tl|grc-transl}}, which takes Ancient Greek text and gives an automatic transliteration. However, I'm not sure if this actually encodes the relevant text with a language tag like {{tl|lang}}, or doesn't, like {{tl|Script/Hebrew}}.

I'd appreciate if someone could check, though I'm not entirely sure the template itself needs to exist...would be nice to see this function rolled into {{tl|lang}} or something.--[[User:Ineffablebookkeeper|Ineffablebookkeeper]] ([[User talk:Ineffablebookkeeper|talk]]) (&#123;&#123;[[Template:ping|ping]]&#125;&#125; me!) 10:10, 15 August 2022 (UTC)
:The first on the list at [[Special:WhatLinksHere/Template:Grc-transl]] is [[Anatomy]], in which I find {{tlx|grc-transl|ἀνατομή}} → {{grc-transl|ἀνατομή}} and the final HTML for that is <syntaxhighlight lang=html inline><span title="Ancient Greek transliteration" lang="grc-Latn"><i>anatomḗ</i></span></syntaxhighlight>. Whilst <code>grc-Latn</code> is probably intended to indicate ancient Greek written in Latin script, it's not a valid [[ISO 639-3]] code. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 06:41, 16 August 2022 (UTC)
::The lang attribute takes a [[IETF language tag|BCP 47]] value (see [https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/HTML/Global_attributes/lang MDN]), and <code>grc-Latn</code> is correct for Ancient Greek in Latin script ([https://r12a.github.io/app-subtags/ checked with this tool]). [[User:the wub|the wub]] [[User_talk:The wub|<span style="color: #080;">"?!"</span>]] 09:41, 16 August 2022 (UTC)

== How does Template:Title language handle transliterated text? ==

I've been wondering this for a while – {{tl|Title language}} will encode an article title in its ISO language code, but I don't know how it handles transliterated text. I'd appreciate, once again, someone with more knowledge having a gander at it.

(I'm also not sure how it handles titles where only part of the text needs a language tag; it only has two parameters at present, one for a language code and one to set italics. If there's no present options to handle this, then it feels like a loophole that needs closing.)--[[User:Ineffablebookkeeper|Ineffablebookkeeper]] ([[User talk:Ineffablebookkeeper|talk]]) (&#123;&#123;[[Template:ping|ping]]&#125;&#125; me!) 11:14, 29 August 2022 (UTC)

== About merged cells in table ==

I was recently highlighted to accessibility issues with regards to merged cells in tables, particularly with regards to [[WP:DTT]]. I like to ask, using a similar example, [[Jordan Chan#Film and television]], the filmography table contain merged cells for the year. It was deemed not accessible to screen readers and using this example, to unmerge and listing each year individually for each row. In terms of accessibility, should the years be left unmerged?

I searched the archive but what I found is about more complex tables with nothing on this common merging of years. If I had misread or missed out, appreciate if someone can point me to the correct archive for my question. Thanks! [[User:Justanothersgwikieditor|Justanothersgwikieditor]] ([[User talk:Justanothersgwikieditor|talk]]) 01:41, 20 September 2022 (UTC)
:{{replyto|Justanothersgwikieditor}} Merged cells like this aren't a problem for screen reader users. I see that at [[User talk:Justanothersgwikieditor/Archive 2#Do not merge cells]], [[User:Treysand|Treysand]] mistakenly cited [[Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Accessibility/Data tables tutorial#Avoiding nested data tables|this section]] of the data tables tutorial (which is not a guideline), but that section refers to tables *within* tables (i.e. two table tags inside each other in the HTML), not row/colspans, as clearly described at [https://joeclark.org/book/sashay/serialization/Chapter10.html the cited source]. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 06:44, 20 September 2022 (UTC)
::@[[User:Graham87|Graham87]] : Thank you for your explanation but I must admit that initially I missed out the section linked by Treysand and my understanding of nested tables to be quite different. Hence I am asking for clarification here. Once again, thanks! [[User:Justanothersgwikieditor|Justanothersgwikieditor]] ([[User talk:Justanothersgwikieditor|talk]]) 06:57, 20 September 2022 (UTC)
:::{{replyto|Justanothersgwikieditor}} Take it from me - if Graham87 says there is no problem, you can rest assured on that 100%. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 20:12, 20 September 2022 (UTC)

== Discussion of Strong template on its talk page ==

There is a continuation of the [[Template talk:Strong#Use in lead sections of articles|discussion]] of the proper usage of the Strong template with respect to the Lead section and the name and aliases of the article subject. A change was made to the documentation [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template:Strong/doc&oldid=1121099592 today] that a) removed the instruction on how and why to use it and b) made a note that there is no consensus to use it in the Lead, with a citation. 

I think the lack of widespread usage of this template, and the Em template, may have something to do with it not being in the MOS examples when it should be used, eg. [[MOS:LEAD]]. It's not enough to make a comment in the template documentation. If this is an accessibility issue, and it is, then using it should be a clear yes. However, I used it recently in a Lead of an article I have been working with, and a long-time editor removed that change. – [[User:Eewilson|Elizabeth (Eewilson)]] <small>(tag or ping me) ([[User talk:Eewilson|talk]])</small> 14:53, 10 November 2022 (UTC)
:{{reply-to|Eewilson}} I've left a comment over there. You're right; leaving a brief comment on accessibility on a template's documentation is useless if it's all but an orphan, with no mentions of its apparent importance in the Very Big Very Important Please Look Here Manuals of Style we have. Who's going to discover such templates frequently enough to make that worthwhile? Only editors digging around in the Template undergrowth are going to discover them that way.—[[User:Ineffablebookkeeper|Ineffablebookkeeper]] ([[User talk:Ineffablebookkeeper|talk]]) (&#123;&#123;[[Template:ping|ping]]&#125;&#125; me!) 17:11, 10 November 2022 (UTC)

== New calendar template ==

{{One page calendar|table-style=float:right}}

The above calendar-table is produced by {{Tl|One page calendar}}, which I have just published (the template will generate a calendar for any Gregorian year). How would you improve its accessibility? Feel free to edit the Lua module directly. <span class="vcard"><span class="fn">[[User:Pigsonthewing|Andy Mabbett]]</span> (<span class="nickname">Pigsonthewing</span>); [[User talk:Pigsonthewing|Talk to Andy]]; [[Special:Contributions/Pigsonthewing|Andy's edits]]</span> 16:47, 11 November 2022 (UTC)
:I can't make head or tail of it on either JAWS or NVDA ... and I honestly have no idea how to even start making it more intuitive for screen reader users, if that's even possible (my HTML table knowledge is about a 2 out of 10 and my lua knowledge is about a 0.002). The unusual month order is a problem, for a start, let alone trying to figure out what the columns and rows mean. I'm obsessed with calendars to the point that I once wrote date calculation functions in the [[JAWS Scripting Language]], for which it is absolutely not designed, and even *I* can't understand this template. My friend [[User:Codeofdusk|Codeofdusk]], who's also blind, can't either; he told me that he just doesn't have the spacial reasoning skills to process it. I'm just not sure that a one-page calendar is really the best idea for general use; {{tl|Calendar}} is perfectly accessible. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 03:22, 12 November 2022 (UTC)
{{clear}}
== "Click" versus "select" in technical writing ==

Users with disabilities have different options for interacting with a user interface. They can use a mouse device, trackpad, touchscreen, voice, and possibly more. Because the word "click" is traditionally associated with a mouse, some technical writing style guides now say that "click" should be used only for mouse devices, while a more generic word such as "select" should be used if the device is not known. For example, assuming that users have different ways to interact with a program, we could ask users to "select" a button, menu item, or keyboard key. A substantial effort would be required to revise documentation in this way. The question is: Will this effort bring significant value to users? Do users with disabilities want to see "click" replaced with "select"? [[Special:Contributions/2600:8800:7109:1500:81D0:8BA1:BCA6:46FB|2600:8800:7109:1500:81D0:8BA1:BCA6:46FB]] ([[User talk:2600:8800:7109:1500:81D0:8BA1:BCA6:46FB|talk]]) 22:06, 28 November 2022 (UTC)
:Speaking only for myself, I think it's a relatively minor issue. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 06:04, 29 November 2022 (UTC)

== Is [[Template:switcher]] WCAG-friendly? ==

I was wondering, whether {{tl|switcher}}'s use on [[ATP_Tour_Masters_1000#Results|Tennis Masters page]] causes any issues with screen readers. [[User:Qwerty284651|Qwerty284651]] ([[User talk:Qwerty284651|talk]]) 18:28, 10 December 2022 (UTC)
:It's fine with screen readers because it's just a standard radio button. I didn't know that was even possible with wikitext, though. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 03:23, 11 December 2022 (UTC)
::Yes, it's possible with wikitext. See [[User:Jackmcbarn/switcher#Testing_new_features|here]]. Note: the two parameters {{code|<nowiki>data-switcher-label-style</nowiki>}} and {{code|<nowiki>data-switcher-top-choices</nowiki>}} listed in the "Testing nee features" subsection are not in the live gadget code at [[MediaWiki:Gadget-switcher.js]] so they cannot affect the gadget. Don't know how much this info is useful, but decided to share it anyway, in case you planned on using it. [[User:Qwerty284651|Qwerty284651]] ([[User talk:Qwerty284651|talk]]) 03:47, 11 December 2022 (UTC)
:There is a related discussion at [[Template talk:Switcher#TOC not working with switcher with subsections]]. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 09:36, 11 December 2022 (UTC)
::@[[User:Redrose64|Redrose64]], I am the one who started that discussion.[[User:Qwerty284651|Qwerty284651]] ([[User talk:Qwerty284651|talk]]) 14:30, 11 December 2022 (UTC)

== [[Wikipedia:Mobile communication bugs]] listed at Requested moves==
[[File:Information.svg|30px|left]]A [[Wikipedia:Requested moves|requested move]] discussion has been initiated for [[Wikipedia:Mobile communication bugs]] to be moved to [[Wikipedia:Communication bugs]]. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion [[Wikipedia talk:Mobile communication bugs#Requested move 16 January 2023|here]].<!-- Wikipedia talk:Mobile communication bugs#Requested move 16 January 2023 crosspost --> —[[User:RMCD bot|RMCD bot]] 19:49, 16 January 2023 (UTC)
:<small>To opt out of RM notifications on this page, transclude {{tlp|bots|2=deny=RMCD bot}}, or set up [[Wikipedia:Article alerts|Article alerts]] for this WikiProject.</small>

== Non-Scrolling Sidebar ==

Wikipedia now uses a non-scrolling sidebar, which can trigger motion sickness and migraines if users scroll. If users have already blocked "smooth" scrolling, some workarounds are to 1. only navigate using page down, and/or 2. in Firefox or a few other browsers, reduce the frame rate; since Firefox prefs also use a non-scrolling sidebar, they ose the same problem. I think *if* Wikipedia is going to use a non-scrolling sidebar, then rather than requiring users to avoid the mouse and/or adjust browser settings, it should have an easily-discoverable button to hide the sidebar, which does not use its own animation when hiding or showing the sidebar. [[Special:Contributions/173.73.0.102|173.73.0.102]] ([[User talk:173.73.0.102|talk]]) 21:38, 20 January 2023 (UTC)

:P.S. Even at only 1 frame/second, it can be disorienting. [[Special:Contributions/173.73.0.102|173.73.0.102]] ([[User talk:173.73.0.102|talk]]) 21:50, 20 January 2023 (UTC)
:P.P.S. Okay, it has the hide button. Even so, it can cause severe motion sickness *before* people notice that it won't scroll and needs to be hidden. [[Special:Contributions/173.73.0.102|173.73.0.102]] ([[User talk:173.73.0.102|talk]]) 21:59, 20 January 2023 (UTC)

:The hide button doesn't work in eink-browser. [[Special:Contributions/173.73.0.102|173.73.0.102]] ([[User talk:173.73.0.102|talk]]) 04:37, 23 January 2023 (UTC)

==Let's remove "disorder" language==
Hi. I noticed there are plently of templates with the label "disorder". I strongly suggest editing those templates to remove such label. For example, instead of "bipolar disorder" it should read only "bipolar". "Borderline personatiy disorder" should be "borderline personality". And so on. 

Psychiatry tends to categorize as disorder anything that it doesn't like, ignoring the likelihood that they are not disorders at all but different ways that the brain has to work. Also, Psychiatric diagnosis many times are completely unscientific<ref>https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/07/190708131152.htm</ref> and tend to do a lot of harm to some people in their self-esteem, career, social life, and even desire to live. 

You can check the article [[Neurodiversity]] and [[Psychiatric survivors movement]] for more context. Regards, <span style="border-radius:8em;padding:0 7px;background:orange">[[User:Thinker78|<span style="color:white">'''Thinker78'''</span>]]</span> [[User talk:Thinker78|(talk)]] 16:50, 24 January 2023 (UTC)

{{reflist-talk}}

== Recent Article layout changes make navigation very slow for visually impaired using screen magnification! ==
{{tracked|T328480}}

I have used assistive tech (text-to-speech screen reading and screen nagnification) for over 25 years.  Wikipedia articles appear to have been reformatted such that the Contents panel (that typically formerly appeared after the headline article summary) has disappeared. As a severely visually impaired user (registered Blind in the UK in 1995) I have used my residual vision to quickly find the article section of interest.  All articles I have accessed in the past week (since late January 2023) omit the Contents panel  and hence either require me to scroll through the article or instigate a search to possibly find where my interest lies.  This is very inefficient when having to use x5 magnification on a 24" screen! In the words of UK's 'Points Of View'.... "Why, oh why....?" did you have to break something that did not need fixing?....IMHO, of course.

Please bring back the shortcut-embedded Contents panel!

Sincerely,

PVR. 31/01/2023 [[Special:Contributions/86.20.143.27|86.20.143.27]] ([[User talk:86.20.143.27|talk]]) 10:29, 31 January 2023 (UTC)
:This is the new [[Wikipedia:Vector 2022|:Vector 2022 skin]]. There are instructions for going back to the old skin in the above link. If you'd like an account so you can go back to the old look, you can email me at {{nospam|grahamwp|gmail.com}} and I can help set one up for you (and help you bypass all the CAPTCHAs. It does indeed have a new table of contents but I have no sight at all and don't used the skin so I don't know how to help you use it. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 15:24, 31 January 2023 (UTC)
:Hi, PVR! I'd suggest creating an account so that you can switch to the old skin and save that preference; Graham87 has given the instructions above. If you don't want to create an account, however, the Table of Contents is hidden inside a pop-up that can be opened using a [[hamburger button]] next to the page title. This is the case for screens smaller than 1000 pixels ''post-scaling'' (that is, after the page has been resized due to zoom). It seems that the accessibility of this has been [[phab:T243126|questioned in the past]], but no concrete solution has been found as of now. I'll copy over your message to the related issue report to give it more visibility, both to other users and to the Wikimedia Foundation employees working on the new skin. <span style="background:#ffff55">'''''[[User:Chlod|Chlod]]'''''</span>&nbsp;<small style="font-size:calc(1em - 2pt)">([[User talk:Chlod|say&nbsp;hi!]])</small> 17:54, 31 January 2023 (UTC)
::On second glance, the linked task might only be related, not exactly the root of the issue. I'll see if this warrants a new task (should no other task for this exist) and update accordingly. <span style="background:#ffff55">'''''[[User:Chlod|Chlod]]'''''</span>&nbsp;<small style="font-size:calc(1em - 2pt)">([[User talk:Chlod|say&nbsp;hi!]])</small> 18:05, 31 January 2023 (UTC)
:::I've created [[phab:T328480|this Phabricator task]] to investigate and track this specific issue. Feel free to leave comments there, especially with your (i.e. anyone reading this') experiences with the new table of contents. <span style="background:#ffff55">'''''[[User:Chlod|Chlod]]'''''</span>&nbsp;<small style="font-size:calc(1em - 2pt)">([[User talk:Chlod|say&nbsp;hi!]])</small> 18:48, 31 January 2023 (UTC)
::::I've just had more of a play with this using the information in the Phabricator task up above with JAWS and NVDA. In JAWS the button to get to the table of contents is called "Unlabelled button 0" and in NVDA it's read out as "Menu button". This is not exactly ideal. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 02:18, 1 February 2023 (UTC)
::::Thanks for filling that task and testing this out! I've sent a response in phab saying the same thing, but the missing label is definitely a regression and we will be fixing that soon. I also mentioned a few related tasks (i.e. adding a notice when the ToC is moved, ensuring the ToC is always accessible via navigation region) that the team would like to implement that should help with the concerns brought up here. Let me know if you have any other questions! [[User:BWang (WMF)|BWang (WMF)]] ([[User talk:BWang (WMF)|talk]]) 16:32, 3 February 2023 (UTC)

== More Realistic Text to Speech - TorToiSe ==

Recently an open source text-to-speech engine called TorToiSe was released -- [https://github.com/neonbjb/tortoise-tts/tree/main/tortoise repo here] -- that has much more realistic prosody (pacing, intonation) than previous TTS. The main downside is it is more computationally intensive to create recordings, about maybe four to eight hours per article on a midrange ($500-1000) GPU. I've been toying around with it, having it read Wikipedia articles, which you can [https://morris.cloud/wikipedia-tts/ listen to here] as a podcast RSS feed of mp3 files. As part of that I've also been working with a few python text processing libraries to "normalize" the speech, that is, to make it easier for a TTS engine to read it without mistakes, which you can see [https://github.com/xenotropic/wikipedia-tts/ at this github repo]. The repo also has scripts to facilitate setting up a system to have TorToiSe read them. That is still a work in progress that I'm chipping away at when I have time. I just wanted to mention it someplace wikipedia-ish in case it is of interest to anyone, and to point others to it as something to be thinking about. At right this moment, TorToiSE seems to be at a sort of an odd place significantly beyond the fast-but-robotic TTS of the past, but not quite 100% to the point of a human. It seems easy to imagine, though, that in the coming years it, or something like it, could be used to generate placeholder audio files for the many unfulfilled [[:Category:Spoken Wikipedia requests|Spoken Wikipedia Requests]], until they can be read by a human. James Betker, the guy who wrote TorToiSe as a hobby is now working at OpenAI, so likely at some point there will be a more refined (and hopefully faster, and still open-source) version out in the world. [[User:Morrisjm|xenotrope]] ([[User talk:Morrisjm|talk]]) 06:51, 3 February 2023 (UTC)

:Are you familiar with [[meta:Wikispeech|Wikispeech]] ? [[User:Sebastian Berlin (WMSE)]] knows quite a bit about it and might have some interest. —[[User:TheDJ|Th<span style="color: green">e</span>DJ]] ([[User talk:TheDJ|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/TheDJ|contribs]]) 12:24, 3 February 2023 (UTC)
::Thanks for the info (and the ping). Something to keep an eye on for Wikispeech. Hopefully we can add it as a TTS engine when it's fast enough. [[User:Sebastian Berlin (WMSE)|Sebastian Berlin (WMSE)]] ([[User talk:Sebastian Berlin (WMSE)|talk]]) 14:20, 3 February 2023 (UTC)
:::Is there a working demo for Wikispeech? I did look at it a few days ago, and again today. Just seems to be [https://wikispeech.wmflabs.org/wiki/Demo,_en a single demo page] that said "Could not load audio" when I clicked play.  [[User:Morrisjm|xenotrope]] ([[User talk:Morrisjm|talk]]) 22:44, 3 February 2023 (UTC)

== HTML tags like ins ==

I've just come across the {{tag|ins|o}} tag; [[WP:REDACT]] states that "Any inserted text should be marked with {{tag|ins}}, which renders in most browsers as underlined text, e.g., inserted".

Does the text read out in a screenreader as having been inserted? Or is it relying on the presence of a visual underline, with no semantic features, to communicate that text has been inserted?—[[User:Ineffablebookkeeper|Ineffablebookkeeper]] ([[User talk:Ineffablebookkeeper|talk]]) (&#123;&#123;[[Template:ping|ping]]&#125;&#125; me!) 20:12, 31 January 2023 (UTC)
:{{replyto|Ineffablebookkeeper}} The {{tag|ins}} and {{tag|del}} tags have been part of HTML since HTML 4.0 (they were proposed for HTML 3.0 but didn't make it into the HTML 3.2 specification), which means that they have been supported by browsers for over 25 years. The present HTML 5.2 spec may be found at either [//www.w3.org/TR/2021/SPSD-html52-20210128/edits.html W3C Recommendation, section 4.6] or [https://html.spec.whatwg.org/multipage/edits.html WhatWG HTML Living Standard, section 4.7].
:Compared to non-semantic purely visual methods like underline and strikethrough, there are at least two benefits to using the ins and del elements: (i) they have semantic meaning - screen readers will call them out as insertions and deletions; (ii) they may enclose block elements such as lists and tables. They are, in fact, the ''only'' HTML elements which may both enclose block elements and be enclosed by inline elements. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 22:37, 31 January 2023 (UTC)
::Both the main Windows screen readers, [[JAWS (screen reader)|JAWS]] and [[NonVisual Desktop Access|NVDA]], now support reading out ins/del elements. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 02:26, 1 February 2023 (UTC)
:::It's also supported by VoiceOver/Safari on iOS (but not on macOS yet) —[[User:TheDJ|Th<span style="color: green">e</span>DJ]] ([[User talk:TheDJ|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/TheDJ|contribs]]) 12:32, 3 February 2023 (UTC)
::::Good to know all of this; I might add this to [[MOS:ACCESS]] and the relevant wikiguides that mention these tags. Thanks!—[[User:Ineffablebookkeeper|Ineffablebookkeeper]] ([[User talk:Ineffablebookkeeper|talk]]) (&#123;&#123;[[Template:ping|ping]]&#125;&#125; me!) 11:18, 4 February 2023 (UTC)

== My personal Wikipedia timeline ==

I've made a [[User:Graham87/Personal Wikipedia timeline|personal timeline of my Wikipedia activities]], which might interest some editors here because I've written about the various accessibility challenges I've had on this site over the years, among other things. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 12:51, 13 February 2023 (UTC)

:Your suspicions were correct. {{lang|fr|Merci}}, {{lang|es|amigo}}. ―[[User:Koavf|Justin (<span style="color:grey">ko'''a'''vf</span>)]]<span style="color:red">❤[[User talk:Koavf|T]]☮[[Special:Contributions/Koavf|C]]☺[[Special:Emailuser/Koavf|M]]☯</span> 19:44, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
:I've only read down to the bottom of the "Early technology access and encyclopedic experiences" section, but it's a pretty good read so far. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 12:03, 14 February 2023 (UTC)
:Thank you Graham. That's very insightful and what a great idea to write something like this down ! —[[User:TheDJ|Th<span style="color: green">e</span>DJ]] ([[User talk:TheDJ|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/TheDJ|contribs]]) 13:21, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

== Wikipedia is now blocking Lynx ==

[[Lynx (web browser)]] is a browser used by blind people.  In March 2023 I found I can no longer read Wikipedia with Lynx because somebody has configured Wikipedia servers to hang indefinitely on any browser connection that identifies itself as Lynx, probably because they were given mistaken advice that Lynx is a hacking tool or something.  I have to set my browser to lie about what it is, which is not good practice and it makes me feel guilty about lying.  Could somebody please look into this and consider unblocking the Lynx browser for accessibility, many thanks. [[Special:Contributions/80.44.31.71|80.44.31.71]] ([[User talk:80.44.31.71|talk]]) 08:40, 2 March 2023 (UTC)
:I don't know of a single blind person who uses Lynx these days. They all use modern browsers. It's not even mentioned in the latest [https://webaim.org/projects/screenreadersurvey9/ this screen reader survey] by [[WebAIM]]. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 15:05, 2 March 2023 (UTC)
::I use Lynx.  WebAIM's survey is quite small and likely has a US bias.  They also chose to group a bunch of browsers into an "Other" category instead of listing them. [[Special:Contributions/80.44.31.71|80.44.31.71]] ([[User talk:80.44.31.71|talk]]) 00:22, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
:Hi IP — I've just navigated to this page using Lynx (2.9.0dev.6, SSL-MM 1.4.1), so it doesn't appear to be an issue targeting Lynx at the very least.. — [[User:TheresNoTime|TheresNoTime]] ([[User talk:TheresNoTime|talk]] • they/them) 15:10, 2 March 2023 (UTC)
:: it's working for me again now as well.  Maybe they fixed it, thanks [[Special:Contributions/80.44.31.71|80.44.31.71]] ([[User talk:80.44.31.71|talk]]) 00:22, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

== Problem with text to speech ==

I use Microsoft Edge, and it has a text to speech option to read me articles, but it keeps mentioning the numbers of the sources, which is really irritating. I hope someone can help me here, since this is probably a problem for people with disabilities too. I would be grateful for a solution :) [[User:Ramka8707|Ramka8707]] ([[User talk:Ramka8707|talk]]) 14:49, 2 March 2023 (UTC)
:{{replyto|Ramka8707}} To remove the footnote numbers you can use [[User:Zhaofeng Li/RefToggle]]. Most blind people would get used to the footnote numbers. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 15:28, 2 March 2023 (UTC)
::Honestly, it is quite shocking to me that people with disabilities have to deal with this stuff. Can I somehow escalate this to a higher authority that could potentially change the footnote problem? Thanks for your help so far :) [[User:Ramka8707|Ramka8707]] ([[User talk:Ramka8707|talk]]) 16:49, 2 March 2023 (UTC)
:::{{replyto|Ramka8707}} I guess so ... see [[mw:How to report a bug|How to report a bug]] ... but whether it will be acted upon is another matter entirely. Blind people have as much of a right to follow footnotes as anyone else. Most of us use screen readers, which give far more control over how text is spoken/output to a [[refreshable Braille display]]  than any browser's in-built text-to-speech feature ever could. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 01:14, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
::::Of course blind people have a right to follow footnotes, never said they don't, but when it comes to accessibility it would really be a great feature, if one could simply deactivate the footnotes in order to let text to speech operate, no? Thank you for the link :) [[User:Ramka8707|Ramka8707]] ([[User talk:Ramka8707|talk]]) 07:45, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
:::::To operate effectively on the web and life in general, blind people and heavy text-to-speech users have to get used to way more than the occasional errant number. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 13:57, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
::::::You are quite right, but we got to enact change wherever we can, right? Anyway, don't want to tie you down with my silly war here. Thank you again for the help you have given me. I am kind of new, so it feels really cool to have such good help straight away :) [[User:Ramka8707|Ramka8707]] ([[User talk:Ramka8707|talk]]) 22:55, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
:::::{{replyto|Ramka8707}} The [[MediaWiki]] software (which is what converts Wiki-markup into usable web pages) does its best to produce web pages that comply with the published recommendations for HTML. The web browser vendors should be writing their browsers in such a way that web pages are presented in a predictable manner according to those same standards, but they don't always do so. Microsoft are notorious for deviating from some of the practices that other browser vendors follow reliably. Sometimes the MediaWiki software will reluctantly introduce adjustments to handle browser quirks, and it can be a real nightmare for the developers to keep up to date with changes in published recommendations and changes in browser behaviour (there are [[List of web browsers|many available]] most of which change several times a year), as well as ensuring that accessibility aids behave as they should. Third-party add-ons similarly need to keep up with the latest changes, but they can give a more satisfactory experience than a browser's inbuilt features.
:::::The numbers in square brackets that are also linked and superscripted are, as far as web browsers are concerned, exactly that - they have no special meaning; they are just links to another part of the same page. Browsers don't know what references are, but they do know how to handle links; and to permit a link to be followed, they need to present the text within the link, and to distinguish one of these links from another, the MediaWiki software uses numbers.
:::::If you ''really'' want to suppress all of the superscripted linked numbers in square brackets, you can do this by placing this CSS rule <syntaxhighlight lang=css>sup.reference { display: none; }</syntaxhighlight> into [[Special:MyPage/common.css]] and saving it. However, this means that you will also suppress the links to the article's sources, although the sources will still appear elsewhere on the page. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 22:01, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
::::::You're completely right about your points. As someone who is sighted, I'm contemplating how easily individuals with disabilities or their family members can access the information you've shared to improve their Wikipedia experience. Have you ever considered why there isn't a readily available "FAQ" with the essential resources? You and I are aware that most people tend to leave after a few clicks, since they haven't learned to navigate this space effectively. I appreciate the work you do, but I'm slightly frustrated (which isn't your fault, I know you do great work, I saw your account). [[User:Ramka8707|Ramka8707]] ([[User talk:Ramka8707|talk]]) 23:20, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
:::Also this question was first posted [[Wikipedia:Teahouse#Problem with text to speech|at the teahouse]]. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 01:21, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

== Accessibility specifically in '''editing''' Wikipedia? ==

Are there any resources, where I can learn about accessibility issues specifically for users who '''edit''' Wikipedia? For example, do some users have trouble using source editing vs. WYSIWYG editing, the Preview button, or edit summaries? What do I, as a Wikipedia editor, need to know about the challenges that my comrades might face? [[User:Mgnbar|Mgnbar]] ([[User talk:Mgnbar|talk]]) 22:21, 20 March 2023 (UTC)
:There's a bit at [[m:WikiBlind User Group#Getting started as a blind editor]] which I helped out with. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 07:53, 21 March 2023 (UTC)

== Colons and asterisks ==

{{fyi|pointer=yes}} There is a post at [[Wikipedia talk:Colons and asterisks#Counterpoint]] that could do with a well-thought-out response. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 22:19, 31 March 2023 (UTC)

== Add accessibility metadata to the Date template ==
See my post at the bottom [[Template_talk:Date#Make the date template emit time metadata, ensuring asscessability and allowing people to view dates in their perferred format.]].  <!-- Template:Unsigned --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:MatthewUtzig|MatthewUtzig]] ([[User talk:MatthewUtzig#top|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/MatthewUtzig|contribs]]) 23:35, 7 April 2023 (UTC)</small> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Is the emphasis template used for species/genus nomenclature? ==

Came across the use of {{tl|em}} to replace italics around the scientific name for a plant species in an article (specifically ''[[Kali tragus]]''); this is the first time I've seen it. To my mind, I wouldn't have thought of the italics used around a genus name as emphasis. Is such usage warranted?—[[User:Ineffablebookkeeper|Ineffablebookkeeper]] ([[User talk:Ineffablebookkeeper|talk]]) (&#123;&#123;[[Template:ping|ping]]&#125;&#125; me!) 10:31, 10 May 2023 (UTC)
:{{ping|Ineffablebookkeeper}} no. It's the convention here to use italics for the scientific names of organisms at the rank of genus and below. Absolutely not emphasis. [[User:Peter coxhead|Peter coxhead]] ([[User talk:Peter coxhead|talk]]) 15:01, 10 May 2023 (UTC)
:I wouldn't say so, no. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 15:12, 10 May 2023 (UTC)
::Thanks for the advice. I think the template documentation mentions something about this, so I'll update it.—[[User:Ineffablebookkeeper|Ineffablebookkeeper]] ([[User talk:Ineffablebookkeeper|talk]]) (&#123;&#123;[[Template:ping|ping]]&#125;&#125; me!) 18:59, 10 May 2023 (UTC)

== Strobing Animations ==

Some wikipedia articles include non-stop autoplaying gifs and/or pngs. It's usually posible to configure desktop browsers to block these. But it's not always possible to configure tablet browsers to block these.

I often use eink due to neuro issues, and with text and static images it helps, but unless I set a blurry "a2" display mode, with animation it starts rapidly flashing between white and black.

The current MOS is inadequate (and feels insulting) because it permits animations if they're no longer than 5 seconds (which is far too long) or or if they have control functions to turn them off (which may not be visible and/or operable in the middle of the blinding pain if you are even mildly affected).[[Special:Contributions/173.73.0.102|173.73.0.102]] ([[User talk:173.73.0.102|talk]]) 06:23, 6 March 2023 (UTC)
:This is (or should be) covered by [[MOS:ANIMATION]]. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 19:41, 6 March 2023 (UTC)
:User has now raised the issue at [[Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Accessibility#Animations Aren't Safe, Especially on E-Ink]]. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 14:54, 13 March 2023 (UTC)
::So is there anything I can do to tag these images for replacement? [[Special:Contributions/173.73.0.102|173.73.0.102]] ([[User talk:173.73.0.102|talk]]) 02:37, 12 May 2023 (UTC)
:::“it starts rapidly flashing between white and black.” I interpret this as “the technology used makes animations even worse” and thus it is not a fundamental content issue. I think animation removal will anger people, I think replacement is not going to happen (labor isn’t free), I think there are no programmers to fix it technology wise (again labor isn’t free) and thus I don’t see a quick solution. I’m not saying your problems aren’t real, but I see no way I personally or most other editors can realistically fix this shortcoming of e-ink displays. —[[User:TheDJ|Th<span style="color: green">e</span>DJ]] ([[User talk:TheDJ|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/TheDJ|contribs]]) 08:19, 13 May 2023 (UTC)
:This is a bit of a [[Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater|"throw out the baby with the bathwater"]] approach, but until someone comes up with something better you can use css to hide all gifs. Edit your [[Help:Cascading Style Sheets#User-specific style-sheets|common.css]] file and add the following:
:img[src$=".gif"] { 
:    display:none;
:}
:No guarantees that this will work in all cases, but I tried it on a few articles with good results. The downside is that it hides ''all'' gifs and you don't even see that there is supposed to be a gif there. [[User:Random person no 362478479|-- Random person no 362478479]] ([[User talk:Random person no 362478479|talk]]) 16:19, 24 May 2023 (UTC)
::And you need an account and have to be logged in to use this method. [[User:Random person no 362478479|-- Random person no 362478479]] ([[User talk:Random person no 362478479|talk]]) 19:52, 24 May 2023 (UTC)

== Extinct template versus just †? ==

Is the {{tl|Extinct}} template (which produces {{extinct}}) more semantically meaningful than †, or are the two the same screenreader-wise?—[[User:Ineffablebookkeeper|Ineffablebookkeeper]] ([[User talk:Ineffablebookkeeper|talk]]) (&#123;&#123;[[Template:ping|ping]]&#125;&#125; me!) 17:17, 16 June 2023 (UTC)
:No, they are not the same. The {{tlx|extinct}} template emits the following HTML: <syntaxhighlight lang=html><abbr title="Extinct" aria-label="Extinct" style="border: none; text-decoration: none; cursor: inherit; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal;">†</abbr></syntaxhighlight> - some screen reader software will pick up that <code>title=</code> attribute. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 21:25, 16 June 2023 (UTC)
::{{reply-to|Redrose64}} Thank you!—[[User:Ineffablebookkeeper|Ineffablebookkeeper]] ([[User talk:Ineffablebookkeeper|talk]]) (&#123;&#123;[[Template:ping|ping]]&#125;&#125; me!) 10:40, 17 June 2023 (UTC)

==Discussion at [[:Template talk:WikiProject banner shell#How project banners should look|Template talk:WikiProject banner shell §&nbsp;How project banners should look]]==
[[File:Symbol watching blue lashes high contrast.svg|25px|link=|alt=]]&nbsp;You are invited to join the discussion at [[:Template talk:WikiProject banner shell#How project banners should look|Template talk:WikiProject banner shell §&nbsp;How project banners should look]].  [[User:DFlhb|DFlhb]] ([[User talk:DFlhb|talk]]) 17:42, 7 July 2023 (UTC)<!-- [[Template:Please see]] -->

Especially interested in your feedback regarding the colours, specifically [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template:WPBannerMeta/testcases&oldid=1164009196 this design]. [[User:DFlhb|DFlhb]] ([[User talk:DFlhb|talk]]) 17:42, 7 July 2023 (UTC)

:Note that there is now an RfC on the matter, which everyone here is invited to. [[User:DFlhb|DFlhb]] ([[User talk:DFlhb|talk]]) 19:28, 9 July 2023 (UTC)
:* Here's the link to the RfC mentioned above: [[Template_talk:WikiProject_banner_shell#RfC|Template talk:WikiProject banner shell#RFC]]. - [[User:47thPennVols|47thPennVols]] ([[User talk:47thPennVols|talk]]) 22:01, 9 July 2023 (UTC)

== Help Desk question about screen reader ==

Someone posted at the help desk about problems they are having accessing Wikipedia using a screen reader: [[Wikipedia:Help_desk#Lack_of_Access]]. Maybe someone here has relevant expertise? [[User:Random person no 362478479|-- Random person no 362478479]] ([[User talk:Random person no 362478479|talk]]) 19:36, 12 July 2023 (UTC)
:I replied there a little earlier before noticing this message. '''[[User:Graham87|Graham]]'''[[User talk:Graham87|<span style="color: green;">87</span>]] 05:49, 13 July 2023 (UTC)

== Flashing image ==

So (Warning re: epilepsy) [[autostereogram]] has a rapidly flashing image on it right at the top of page. Yeah. I don't have epilepsy, but I was still shocked by that thing just starting to animate outta nowhere when randomly navigating there.

I suspect an IP deleting content might provoke a revert from an overly enthusiastic vandalism patroller so hopefully someone doesn't mind [[do the needful|doing the needful]]. Might also not hurt to put some kind of note or editnotice about animations and link to the accessibility guidelines since that's a page that will always attract well-meaning but unaware people looking to add animated content there for visualizing the effect. [[Special:Contributions/47.155.41.201|47.155.41.201]] ([[User talk:47.155.41.201|talk]]) 08:44, 6 August 2023 (UTC)

== Template:IPA vowels/accessible ==

{{fyi|pointer=y}} Regarding [[Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Accessibility/Archive 14#Template:IPA vowels]]: [[Template:IPA vowels/accessible]] has been sent to TfD. The discussion is at [[Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2023 August 7#Template:IPA vowels/accessible]]. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 18:29, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

== Fractions in category names ==

{{fyi|pointer=y}} Please see [[Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Dates and numbers#Fractions in category names]]. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 20:43, 12 August 2023 (UTC)

== Dispute at [[WP:DRN]] ==

I am mediating a content dispute at [[WP:DRN|DRN]] concerning the display of the scores of [[association football|football]].  One of the issues is that one of the editors states that some of the templates that are being used to display club seasons does not comply with [[MOS:ACCESS|the accessibility  guidelines]].  Here is how I am asking for assistance from this project.  I would like to request an experienced editor to look at the dispute, and either say that some of the templates that we are using are not access-compliant, or that the templates that we are using do satisfy [[MOS:ACCESS|the accessibility guidelines]].  The editors with the accessibility issue can come to this project page and present their cases, or it would be useful if an experienced editor who is familiar with accessibility joined in the discussion at DRN.  Thank you in advance for any help you can give.  [[User:Robert McClenon|Robert McClenon]] ([[User talk:Robert McClenon|talk]]) 05:23, 22 September 2023 (UTC)

== Discussion about [[MOS:ACCESS]] at GAN talk ==

I've started a discussion about incorporating (parts of) [[MOS:ACCESS]] into [[WP:GACR|GACR]] at the [[Wikipedia talk:Good article nominations#Should (parts of) MOS:ACCESS be incorporated into GACR?|GAN talk page]]. Best, [[User:Voorts|voorts]] ([[User talk:Voorts|talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Voorts|contributions]]) 16:20, 24 September 2023 (UTC)

== Table column in The X Factor article which only conveys information using colour ==

I started a discussion at [[Talk:The X Factor#Table under "The X Factor around the world" is not accessible to screen reader users]]. As the talk page seems pretty dormant and I have had no replies, I thought I'd mention it here to see what could be done about it if anything. [[User:KaraLG84|KaraLG84]] ([[User talk:KaraLG84|talk]]) 21:23, 29 September 2023 (UTC)

== Weird bug with JAWS/Chrome inserting misplaced spaces in output ==

See [[Template talk:Val#Screen reader problems with digits grouped by spaces in this template]], in which I discover that the problem really isn't with that template at all but a JAWS/Chrome bug. There's nothing we can do about it here so this is just an FYI. [[User:Graham87|Graham87]] ([[User talk:Graham87|talk]]) 11:40, 2 October 2023 (UTC)

== Place topic headings right above where content begins ==
{{moved from|Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Accessibility/FAQ and common pitfalls}} [[User:Graham87|Graham87]] ([[User talk:Graham87|talk]]) 07:32, 8 November 2023 (UTC)

Visually impaired visitors need a heading at level 1 placed where content begins. On every Wikipedia page, there are a series of links, at best only remotely related, to the topic  before the actual content begins. It forces visually impaired people to waste time arrowing around for each  article's true beginning. [[Special:Contributions/108.54.91.238|108.54.91.238]] ([[User talk:108.54.91.238|talk]]) 21:16, 7 November 2023 (UTC)
:As a fellow screen reader user, I can confirm that this indeed occurs with the new theme/skin, [[WP:VECTOR2022|Vector 2022]] because the heading is in a different position in the HTML (which better reflects how sighted people see the page). The easiest way to get around this is to press a key to move to the next block of non-link text (usually n) after going to the first-level heading. However, if you want the old Wikipedia look back, I can create an account for you and help you revert to an older Wikipedia skin. If this is what you would like, email me at {{nospam|grahamwp@gmail.com}} and I can take it from there. [[User:Graham87|Graham87]] ([[User talk:Graham87|talk]]) 07:32, 8 November 2023 (UTC)

== Low vision, but not blind ==

I just read this wikiproject page and perused the talk page. Are there guidelines for formatting to accommodate users who might have low vision issues (not actually blind, and not using any accommodative technology)? 

I have poor eyesight (that's all I'm going to say on it) and, as examples, I like a lot of whitespace (glossary style rather than bulleted lists which present as walls of text), no unnecessary table formats (difficult to edit), and simpler images which show the subject (rather than 'busy' images which ''contain'' the subject but are hard to distinguish).

I haven't found any policies that suggest these ideas. Currently I'm dealing with swapping out images for better, simpler ones, but occasionally run into someone who wants to keep their favorite photos on display. A policy would be nice to support my changes. <span style="text-shadow:#000 0em 0em 1em">[[User:Grorp|<span style="color:#6a0dad"> &nbsp;&nbsp;▶ I am Grorp ◀ </span>]]</span> 02:24, 12 November 2023 (UTC)

:All that immediately comes to mind is having accessibility via CSS to increase font size and contrast and to use SVG where appropriate, so it can be infinitely magnified with no loss of clarity. It would probably be nice if we had collections of user scripts that enhance visibility... ―[[User:Koavf|Justin (<span style="color:grey">ko'''a'''<span style="color:black">v</span>f</span>)]]<span style="color:red">❤[[User talk:Koavf|T]]☮[[Special:Contributions/Koavf|C]]☺[[Special:Emailuser/Koavf|M]]☯</span> 02:28, 12 November 2023 (UTC)

== Tool/Gadget for checking accessibility? ==

I'm curious if there is a Wikipedia-specific tool/gadget people can use to check a page's accessibility. I know other communities have specific tools/gadgets to make their jobs easier. For example, [[WP:DYK|Did You Know...?]] (DYK), has something that with a single click analyzes the page for various factors to help determine eligibility for DYK. There's also the [https://edwardbetts.com/find_link/ Edward Betts] 'tool' for finding links to articles (often used to help [[WP:ORPHAN|orphaned articles]]) or [https://copyvios.toolforge.org/|Copyvio check] I'm wondering if there's something similar so users can quickly check the accessibility of a page and learn how to fix it, kind of like the "Check accessibility" feature in Microsoft Word. [[User:Significa liberdade|Significa liberdade <small>(she/her)</small>]] ([[User talk:Significa liberdade|talk]]) 20:44, 22 November 2023 (UTC)

:I had the same question.  I looked at https://webaim.org/projects/screenreadersurvey9/?hss_channel=tw-2382446636 and picked [[VoiceOver]], as it was readily available to me.  YMMV. [[User:RudolfoMD|RudolfoMD]] ([[User talk:RudolfoMD|talk]]) 09:07, 30 November 2023 (UTC)

== Way to specify alt text for something other than an image (e.g. math)? ==

I came up with a great way to convey that a drug has a critical FDA-mandated [[black-box warning]]: the word "Warning" in a black box. See [[User:RudolfoMD/sandbox2]].  Great for sighted folks, that is.  Is there a way to specify alt text for the math tag to be used or otherwise make the warning more accessible? Didn't find anything at [[Help:Displaying a formula]]; could use some guidance.  I want to add this to so it appears in the infobox of hundreds of articles.  T.I.A. [[User:RudolfoMD|RudolfoMD]] ([[User talk:RudolfoMD|talk]]) 09:18, 30 November 2023 (UTC)

:Math has hidden [[MathML]], which most screenreaders can handle and read out. And they will do that for this too. Please do not use math for decoration purposes. Just write a template with CSS styling. —[[User:TheDJ|Th<span style="color: green">e</span>DJ]] ([[User talk:TheDJ|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/TheDJ|contribs]]) 10:21, 30 November 2023 (UTC)
::Thanks.  No clue how to do that (CSS styling), but I could try to figure it out or seek help.  It was interesting to look at the source though, and gave me another idea.
::The source that displays the math (in my browser) at its core is just an image with alt text. We could use the image and improve the alt text. Like <a href="/wiki/Boxed_warning">...<img src="/media/api/rest_v1/media/math/render/svg/1735879add6c04cad562b5f3646d25a4ddf3d8bb" ... aria-hidden="true" ... alt="WARNING"></a>.  I can do that.  Seem reasonable?  
::(Also interesting that the image is an SVG containing alt text: 
::<code>aria-labelledby="MathJax-SVG-1-Title"></code>
::<code><title id="MathJax-SVG-1-Title">{\displaystyle {\begin{array}{|}\hline W\!ARNING\\\hline \end{array}}}</title></code>
::<code><defs aria-hidden="true"></code>
::<s>I wonder if good internal alt text makes separate alt text unnecessary; I presume that's the idea.</s> edit: Nah. Alt probably better for lynx. )
::-R
::{{collapse|title=The whole source (only possibly worth reading, and so  collapsed and thus certainly not worth the effort of beautifully formatting it but wikignome Redrose64 did so anyway :-) ). (I wonder if a template exists/could be made to such  problems without the use of the obscure syntaxhighlight thing. [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?search=syntaxhighlight&title=Special:Search&profile=advanced&fulltext=1&ns10=1 Seems like it; can't tell.])|<syntaxhighlight lang=xml><a href="/wiki/Boxed_warning" title=""><span class="mwe-math-element"><span class="mwe-math-mathml-inline mwe-math-mathml-a11y" style="display: none;"><math xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML" alttext="{\displaystyle {\begin{array}{|}\hline W\!ARNING\\\hline \end{array}}}">
  <semantics>
    <mrow class="MJX-TeXAtom-ORD">
      <mstyle displaystyle="true" scriptlevel="0">
        <mrow class="MJX-TeXAtom-ORD">
          <mtable columnalign="" rowspacing="4pt" columnspacing="1em" rowlines="" columnlines="" frame="solid">
            <mtr>
              <mtd>
                <mi>W</mi>
                <mspace width="negativethinmathspace"></mspace>
                <mi>A</mi>
                <mi>R</mi>
                <mi>N</mi>
                <mi>I</mi>
                <mi>N</mi>
                <mi>G</mi>
              </mtd>
            </mtr>
          </mtable>
        </mrow>
      </mstyle>
    </mrow>
    <annotation encoding="application/x-tex">{\displaystyle {\begin{array}{|}\hline W\!ARNING\\\hline \end{array}}}</annotation>
  </semantics>
</math></span><img src="/media/api/rest_v1/media/math/render/svg/1735879add6c04cad562b5f3646d25a4ddf3d8bb" class="mwe-math-fallback-image-inline mw-invert" aria-hidden="true" style="vertical-align: -1.338ex; width:15.29ex; height:3.843ex;" alt="{\displaystyle {\begin{array}{|}\hline W\!ARNING\\\hline \end{array}}}"></span></a></syntaxhighlight>}} 
:: [[User:RudolfoMD|RudolfoMD]] ([[User talk:RudolfoMD|talk]]) 19:25, 30 November 2023 (UTC)
:::Figured out the CSS, I think.  (Couldn't figure out the image method; wouldn't render right.)  Edited [[Template:Drugboxwarns]] to use CSS. 
:::Thus:  [[Boxed warning|<span style="border:thin solid black;">WARNING</span>]]<ref name="FDA-AllBoxedWarnings">{{cite web |title=FDA-sourced list of all drugs with black box warnings (Use Download Full Results and View Query links.) |url=https://nctr-crs.fda.gov/fdalabel/ui/spl-summaries/criteria/343802 |website=nctr-crs.fda.gov |publisher=[[FDA]] |access-date=22 Oct 2023}}</ref>.
:::: :-)
:::[[User:RudolfoMD|RudolfoMD]] ([[User talk:RudolfoMD|talk]]) 06:50, 2 December 2023 (UTC)

{{reftalk}}
== Social impact of depersonalising language such as 'the colourblind' ==

Please tell me if this is in the wrong place. I live with a motor neurone disease but I am not defined by living with a motor neurone disease, I am defined by being a person. I was shocked upon reading the page on Colour blindness that within 5 lines of the start of the article the ableist social convention that defines people as their problem and not as people appears in the form 'the colorblind automatically develop...' These are people first and colour blindness is a secondary attribute, so we should always be aiming at modern best practice which is to use 'people who live with colour blindness...' or 'people who are colourblind...' or 'those who are...'. The section entitled 'Effects' starts 'A colorblind subject...' and in the same sentence has 'the colourblind...'. They are not scientific specimens as 'subject' suggests, nor are they a problem as 'the colourblind' suggests. These are living, breathing people not objects, so I am certain that there must be a place for this discussion but cannot find it and thus put it here. Please forgive me, I am English and have used colour throughout this paragraph, but absolutely accept the the American spelling, color, is acceptable throughout Wikipedia. [[User:DrRickZTTwo|DrRickZTTwo]] ([[User talk:DrRickZTTwo|talk]]) 11:59, 1 August 2023 (UTC)

:This is a fine place to put this concern. That said, I'm confused: do you object to "The French have developed a long history of bread and cheese" or "Peruvians are proud of their Incan heritage"? ―[[User:Koavf|Justin (<span style="color:grey">ko'''a'''vf</span>)]]<span style="color:red">❤[[User talk:Koavf|T]]☮[[Special:Contributions/Koavf|C]]☺[[Special:Emailuser/Koavf|M]]☯</span> 12:05, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
::Thanks Justin, I am glad I got the correct location. I am quite certain that if French and Peruvian people object to being referred to thus, they will raise the issue. My concern is with those of us who live with disabilities and are defined by society as being a problem. I do not regard being French or Peruvian as being either a disability or a problem and thus both are perfectly acceptable. Does that distinction make sense? Personally I get called 'the afflicted', 'the disabled, and 'the sick', but I am first and foremost a person. It is difficult enough living with a disability without people treating you as though you have ceased to exist and become a problem. People who live with colour blindness undoubtedly live with a disability, but it does not define who they are, being merely one of a number of attributes that they, as a person, possess. Rick [[User:DrRickZTTwo|DrRickZTTwo]] ([[User talk:DrRickZTTwo|talk]]) 12:18, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
:::Sure, but 1.) by definition you {{em|won't}} hear from those who {{em|don't}} object and 2.) which qualities/properties/aspects of a person do you think can be adjectives in front of nouns and which ones not? ―[[User:Koavf|Justin (<span style="color:grey">ko'''a'''vf</span>)]]<span style="color:red">❤[[User talk:Koavf|T]]☮[[Special:Contributions/Koavf|C]]☺[[Special:Emailuser/Koavf|M]]☯</span> 12:20, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
::::Thanks for this Justin, I suspect that the resources which you have listed below are going to be part of the answer to that question, but ultimately the answer is whether or not there is any social stigma which can be attached to such a word. I am the scientist, the biologist, the educator, the teacher and the unexpectedly successful artist, I am not the sick, the disabled, the autistic, the afflicted or the dying. It is a line which is drawn by social convention and social convention is decided by consensus through discussion, like this one. I am getting tired, so may have to come back to this later - my apologies. [[User:DrRickZTTwo|DrRickZTTwo]] ([[User talk:DrRickZTTwo|talk]]) 12:57, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
:::::No worries, friend: we all sleep. Happy to have the conversation when/as you can. ―[[User:Koavf|Justin (<span style="color:grey">ko'''a'''vf</span>)]]<span style="color:red">❤[[User talk:Koavf|T]]☮[[Special:Contributions/Koavf|C]]☺[[Special:Emailuser/Koavf|M]]☯</span> 13:00, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
:::Do you find this language issue to be a widespread problem in Wikipedia? Or is [[Color blindness]] the only example you have seen? If it's the latter, then the correct venue for discussion is [[Talk:Color blindness]]. But actually the best course of action is to [[Wikipedia:Be bold]] and edit [[Color blindness]] yourself.
:::I'm happy to edit it for you, but I do have one question: What about the phrase "colour-blind people" or "colourblind people"? [[User:Mgnbar|Mgnbar]] ([[User talk:Mgnbar|talk]]) 12:25, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
::::Oh, I see, from the materials that you've posted below, that "colour-blind people" is not sufficient to fix the issue. Thanks. [[User:Mgnbar|Mgnbar]] ([[User talk:Mgnbar|talk]]) 12:49, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
:::::Thank you Mgnbar, both for your first question which is a good one and is going to require some research, and for getting to the resources that Justin posted before I did and answering your own question - much appreciated. I have used up what energy I have today, so will need to stop now, but will come back and, if you have not already edited it, edit the colour blindness page, once I have read the resources. I will also, probably fairly slowly, research other areas to see how widespread such language is. Thank you. [[User:DrRickZTTwo|DrRickZTTwo]] ([[User talk:DrRickZTTwo|talk]]) 13:04, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
::::::I've made numerous edits to [[Color blindness]], but there's still much to do, both on this issue and other issues in that article. [[User:Mgnbar|Mgnbar]] ([[User talk:Mgnbar|talk]]) 13:29, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
:::::::Thank you Mgnbar, I visited the page and you have already vastly improved it. Elsewhere I came across a welcome message (from 2012 - in another lifetime before Nortriptyline damaged my memory - now mostly fixed by many years of hard work, and the rare motor neurone disease with which I live turned my life upside down). It mentioned using four tildes in signing off on discussion pages. On this page it appears to have inserted the information on username and time automatically, perhaps because I initiated the discussion. Although having said that, inserting them here has automatically added them to the preview. [[User:DrRickZTTwo|DrRickZTTwo]] ([[User talk:DrRickZTTwo|talk]]) 00:56, 2 August 2023 (UTC)
:Relevant parts of the Manual of Style:
:*[[MOS:MEDLANG]]
:*[[Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Psychology#Audience_and_language]]
:Relevant discussions on the topic:
:*[[Wikipedia_talk:Manual_of_Style/Archive_222#Person-first_language]]
:*[https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?search=%22person-first%22&prefix=Wikipedia+talk%3AManual+of+Style&title=Special:Search&profile=advanced&fulltext=1&ns0=1&searchToken=4sckc2tgbll2y6ui8s5yi4hcx More]
:―[[User:Koavf|Justin (<span style="color:grey">ko'''a'''vf</span>)]]<span style="color:red">❤[[User talk:Koavf|T]]☮[[Special:Contributions/Koavf|C]]☺[[Special:Emailuser/Koavf|M]]☯</span> 12:34, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
::Thank you Justin, I shall work my way through these resources, and will also introduce my wife to them, because in life outside Wikipedia, she is a Bishop's advisor on Accessibility in a Diocese of the Church of England and there is no doubt that she can learn from the relevant parts of the Manual of Style and the Person-first_language archived discussion. She may also be able to contribute to the continuing evolution of the Manual of Style, if she chooses to become part of the Wikipedia team. Thank you once again for asking intelligent questions and for being so welcoming and kind. [[User:DrRickZTTwo|DrRickZTTwo]] ([[User talk:DrRickZTTwo|talk]]) 01:14, 2 August 2023 (UTC)
:::@[[User:DrRickZTTwo|DrRickZTTwo]] Thank you for bringing this up. After @[[User:Mgnbar|Mgnbar]] made the changes this summer, I looked into this fascinating topic and learned a lot. My interpretation is: while motor neuron disease may fall better under the [[medical model of disability]] and therefore demand [[people-first language]], colorblindness falls better under the [[social model of disability]]. To avoid the [[medicalization]] of colorblindness, I feel avoiding people-first language is the best option (for colorblindness specifically). [[User:Curran919|Curran919]] ([[User talk:Curran919|talk]]) 22:53, 24 December 2023 (UTC)

== Skip to talk and accessibility ==

Hello,

I always assumed the [[:Template:Skip to talk]] was primarily for accessibility allowing screen readers to skip past heading content, however when I read the template page, no mention is made of accessibility, so I may very well be under false impressions. Not urgent, but clarification as to its role in accessibility might help the template page. <span style="font-family:Courier;"><b>&nbsp;//&nbsp;[[User:TimothyBlue|Timothy]]&nbsp;::&nbsp;[[User talk:TimothyBlue|talk]]&nbsp;</b></span> 05:30, 10 January 2024 (UTC)

: I'm not sure it's related to accessibility. I think it's just to skip long talk page preambles... like on [[Talk:Scientology|this page]]. I get tired of scrolling down to get to the table of contents. <span style="text-shadow:#000 0em 0em 1em">[[User:Grorp|<span style="color:#6a0dad"> &nbsp;&nbsp;▶ I am Grorp ◀ </span>]]</span> 06:17, 10 January 2024 (UTC)

== Query re articles tagged with WikiProject Accessibility template ==

I noticed that there's a ton of articles tagged with this project's template. Considering this project deals with the accessibility of Wikipedia as a whole rather than improving disability related articles, I was wondering what the best thing to do about it is. [[User:KaraLG84|KaraLG84]] ([[User talk:KaraLG84|talk]]) 00:35, 4 February 2024 (UTC)
:This project was created [[Special:Permalink/164047865|in October 2007]], long before the [[Special:Permalink/367381787|creation of WikiProject Disability in 2010]], so the fact that we have [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Accessibility#Templates|articles under our scope]] is basically a historical artifact (ditto with the concept of this WikiProject, to be honest). To cut a long story short, the people who created this project were quite ambitious and are no longer here ... and I wasn't and am still not quite so keen but I'm still around. :-) WikiProjects as an institution are generally not doing too well these days; a cleanup could be done but I don't have a strong opinion on it. [[User:Graham87|Graham87]] ([[User talk:Graham87|talk]]) 04:49, 4 February 2024 (UTC)

== Line-Height in Mobile Wikipedia ==

I can't use Vector Wikipedia due to migraines, and redirect to Mobile Wikipedia.

I also switch fonts and increase font sizes due to eye strain. Now Mobile Wikipedia limits many lines to 24 px to 27 px. Which can be awfully cramped. I think Mobile Wikipedia should either revert the change or use a multiple of the users' specified font size. [[Special:Contributions/173.66.17.86|173.66.17.86]] ([[User talk:173.66.17.86|talk]]) 02:27, 16 February 2024 (UTC)
:This is being discussed at [[Wikipedia:Village pump (technical)#Mobile font line spacing]]. I'll copy your comment over there and any other comments should be made there. [[User:Graham87|Graham87]] ([[User talk:Graham87|talk]]) 07:35, 16 February 2024 (UTC)

== Proposed tracking for images without alt text ==

There is a [[Wikipedia talk:Linter#Wikipedia Mobile App: Image Recommendations and New Lint Error|proposal at Wikipedia talk:Linter]] which may be of interest to users here. The idea is track use of images without alt text, and then to surface adding alt text as a suggested "microtask" in the Wikipedia mobile app. [[User:the wub|the wub]] [[User_talk:The wub|<span style="color: #080;">"?!"</span>]] 11:45, 27 February 2024 (UTC)

== Accessibility cleanup tags ==

Looking thru [[:Category:Cleanup templates]], I don't see any tags specifically calling out accessibility issues. I'm thinking that we could have a couple to flag issues with articles like "This article may not have sufficient color contrast" or "This article uses tables lacking semantic data ([[MOS:TABLECAPTION|captions]] and [[MOS:DTAB|scopes]])" or "This article uses tables with [[MOS:COLHEAD|column headers]]". This could be useful for users who don't feel confident directly editing complex tables without messing them up or who may not be able to figure out appropriate color contrast themselves. Do others think that a few tags like this would be handy? If so, which other kinds of tags could/should we have? Thanks. ―[[User:Koavf|Justin (<span style="color:grey">ko'''a'''<span style="color:black">v</span>f</span>)]]<span style="color:red">❤[[User talk:Koavf|T]]☮[[Special:Contributions/Koavf|C]]☺[[Special:Emailuser/Koavf|M]]☯</span> 06:03, 20 February 2024 (UTC)
:We have {{tlx|overcoloured}}. --[[User:Redrose64|<span style="color:#a80000; background:#ffeeee; text-decoration:inherit">Red</span>rose64]] &#x1f339; ([[User talk:Redrose64|talk]]) 22:58, 20 February 2024 (UTC)
::I have a similar question. I've been unable to find any tags regarding animations. I also tried video. Is there a page which lists all the templates relevant to accessibility? Even a general template called "accessibility (see talk page)" would do. I really want something to attract attention, other than a talk page topic.
::[[User:Humphrey Tribble|Humpster]] ([[User talk:Humphrey Tribble|talk]]) 01:36, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
:::[[Template:Accessibility dispute]] <span style="font-weight:bold;color:darkblue">[[User:Moxy|Moxy]]</span>🍁 01:39, 20 June 2024 (UTC)